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aitopes
December 9th, 2008, 11:48 AM
Hi folks!:)

This is my first message in this forum.

I'm looking for information about Hercules video cards.

In fact, I want use one of these cards in my projects with microcontrollers. I need information on how to communicate with the ISA bus.

Data such as:
What are the control lines?:confused:
what are the lines of data?:confused:
As is the memory map?:confused:

and things like that.

Know of any place where I can find this information?

Thank you! :D

Terry Yager
December 9th, 2008, 12:36 PM
Wow! The information you're seeking could fill a book. Oh, yeah...I just happen to have one right here handy. Would you like a (XEROX) copy of IBM Technical Reference manual for shipping cost? Pm me...

--T

aitopes
December 9th, 2008, 12:43 PM
Hello Terry!

I am from Argentina.

It is possible that the shipment leaves more expensive than buying the book in a store.

Let me see if I find around here (or PDF), and then see if it is necessary that you take the trouble to send them:)

Thank you!

MikeS
December 9th, 2008, 12:49 PM
*IBM* published specs for the *Hercules* graphics card???

MikeS
December 9th, 2008, 01:06 PM
The Wiki and a 6845 datasheet would be a start; details of the ISA bus are also out there on the Web. There was a fair bit of info supplied with the card in the old days; maybe someone has one of those manuals; I'll look around here, but not likely.

per
December 9th, 2008, 01:08 PM
Hello Terry!

I am from Argentina.

It is possible that the shipment leaves more expensive than buying the book in a store.

Let me see if I find around here (or PDF), and then see if it is necessary that you take the trouble to send them:)

Thank you!

Here is the TechRef, but you'll only find info on the CGA and MDA there. The Hercules card does full emulation of the feautres of the MDA (Mode 7), and it includes some additional graphic capabilities I don't know about (mode 8 or something like that).

ftp://ftp.oldskool.org/pub/misc/IBM5160TechRef.pdf

aitopes
December 9th, 2008, 01:09 PM
Thanks Per!
Going....

Chuck(G)
December 9th, 2008, 01:40 PM
Which Herc card do you have? (i.e. Standard, Graphics Plus, InColor, etc.). I think I've got something here on programming the graphics mode that I can at least scan and send along.

aitopes
December 9th, 2008, 01:49 PM
Hello Chuck!
I have a standar Hercules Graphic card. The most common model, with an LPT port inside.

I found this: ftp://ftp.oldskool.org/pub/misc/IBM5160TechRef.pdf

In the page 125 have some util data, but no is sufficient ;)

Thanks in advance.

aitopes
December 9th, 2008, 01:54 PM
More interesting stuff:

http://www.seasip.info/VintagePC/mda.html

(i work in the translate to spanish) :rolleyes:

Terry Yager
December 9th, 2008, 02:24 PM
*IBM* published specs for the *Hercules* graphics card???

Prob'ly not, but the three questions asked specific to the ISA bus are addressed, as well as the generic 'and things like that'. I just think it's always a good place to start.

--T

per
December 9th, 2008, 11:33 PM
Do you know the model number, GB101, GB102, GB112, etc...?

aitopes
December 10th, 2008, 12:38 AM
Yes, is a "clone", a MGP TM6066A video card

Chips: SIS 23c01, SIS86c22, etc.

aitopes
December 10th, 2008, 12:42 AM
This one:
http://82.114.193.227/vga/image/sbirky/palcal/sis86c22.jpg

per
December 10th, 2008, 12:44 AM
Yes, is a "clone", a MGP TM6066A video card

Chips: SIS 23c01, SIS86c22, etc.

This: http://th99.dyndns.org/v/U-Z/50629.htm ?

*Edit*
I see. It should sill work the same as a normal Hercules. I doubt it does color.

Terry Yager
December 10th, 2008, 06:03 AM
15-pin video port?

--T

per
December 10th, 2008, 07:47 AM
15-pin video port?

--T

I guess that's more or less obvious.

Terry Yager
December 10th, 2008, 12:48 PM
I guess that's more or less obvious.

If that's the case, there's no telling what manner of beast this is, but it ain't Hercules, and prob'ly not even Herc-compatible. More likely a monochrome VGA-compat.

--T

aitopes
December 10th, 2008, 12:51 PM
Hello!
Sorry for delay.

The video conector have 9 pin.
And....the video card work fine with a Samsung Ambar monitor. Is an Hercules (clone, oviusly) card.

Ariel Palazzesi
Web: www.ucontrol.com.ar
Foro: http://www.ucontrol.com.ar/forosmf/index.php
Visita www.neoteo.com

per
December 10th, 2008, 12:55 PM
If that's the case, there's no telling what manner of beast this is, but it ain't Hercules, and prob'ly not even Herc-compatible. More likely a monochrome VGA-compat.

--T

Search for "SiS 86C22" on the following page for at least one reference: http://82.114.193.227/vga/rservice.php?akce=tisk&cisloclanku=2007070001

Seems like some companies did make Hercules clones. Try to run a game or an very early version of Windows in "hercules" mode with it (you might have to rune a setup or do an installation).

Terry Yager
December 10th, 2008, 01:42 PM
Hello!
Sorry for delay.

The video conector have 9 pin.
And....the video card work fine with a Samsung Ambar monitor. Is an Hercules (clone, oviusly) card.

Ariel Palazzesi
Web: www.ucontrol.com.ar
Foro: http://www.ucontrol.com.ar/forosmf/index.php
Visita www.neoteo.com

Ok, 9- pins. Now we're talking a possible Herc- compatible, but I still doubt it. My guess is a monochrome CGA-compatible, which is able to display grey-scale CGA type graphics on a TTL-mono monitor. (I have a similar board right here in my hands right now). My 'best guess' is based on the 'mga' designation on this board. Many manufacturers of Herc cloned would use the term 'HGA' to indicate that their card was Herc-compatible, while the term 'MGA' was usually used to indicate the CGA compatible boards.

Have you actually run a program on it in Herc mode?

--T

per
December 10th, 2008, 10:19 PM
Ok, 9- pins. Now we're talking a possible Herc- compatible, but I still doubt it. My guess is a monochrome CGA-compatible, which is able to display grey-scale CGA type graphics on a TTL-mono monitor. (I have a similar board right here in my hands right now). My 'best guess' is based on the 'mga' designation on this board. Many manufacturers of Herc cloned would use the term 'HGA' to indicate that their card was Herc-compatible, while the term 'MGA' was usually used to indicate the CGA compatible boards.

Have you actually run a program on it in Herc mode?

--T

Do you know if the ATI small wonder graphics sollution (v2) does CGA output to a mono monitor?

Chuck(G)
December 10th, 2008, 11:54 PM
Yup, it's an MGA. 64Kx8 RAM 23C01 character ROM.

ISTR that DOSSHELL under MS-DOS 6.x has a Herc driver and various character fonts. I'll do some digging for programming information tomorrow.

Windows 3.1 supported Hercules graphics as did quite a few games.

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 06:38 AM
C'mon guys; VGA/CGA with a printer port?

This is an ordinary Hercules-compatible mono graphics and printer combo, common as dirt in those days, and practically every clone doing 'real' work had one; I'm amazed you haven't seen one.

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 06:54 AM
Do you know if the ATI small wonder graphics sollution (v2) does CGA output to a mono monitor?
----------
The Graphics Solution card was indeed a 'small wonder', but that name was used with the EGA card.

Of course the Graphics Solution can do CGA on TTL mono - that's what it's for:

It can display CGA, MDA, HGC, Plantronics, and ATI 132 columns on a mono TTL, a CGA, the PC Portable, a composite mono or colour, or a multi-frequency or MultiSync monitor (with a few caveats). Great little card in its day; still have a few..

per
December 11th, 2008, 06:59 AM
----------
The Graphics Solution card was in indeed a small wonder, but that name was used with the EGA card.

Of course the Graphics Solution can do CGA on TTL mono - that's what it's for:

It can display CGA, MDA, HGC, Plantronics, and ATI 132 columns on a mono TTL, a CGA, the PC Portable, a composite mono or colour, or a multi-frequency or MultiSync monitor (with a few caveats). Great little card in its day; still have a few..

There WAS actually a card named "Smal wonder" made in 1988. I'm holding one right now, and here is the link to TH99: http://th99.dyndns.org/v/A-B/52893.htm

In addition to the Graphics solution, it got CGA compatible headers (lightpen & stuff). The Chipset consist of the ATI 18700 and ATI8824CDA. Do you know if it is as good as the regular Graphics soultion?

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 07:07 AM
I stand corrected, thank you; I was thinking of the EGA wonder.

I'm looking at one of the cards and it does indeed say Small Wonder, Graphics Solution;
however, on the boxes it only says Graphics Solution, and I don't recall them ever being called anything else back then.

I take it you don't have the manual or you would not have asked your question. If you need any info or the software, PM me.

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 07:21 AM
Hi per:

I got your PM and I'll gladly send you what I have, but you'll probably be disappointed.

I just looked at the manual and it doesn't mention the jumpers or auxiliary connectors at all (!); the cards I have are V1 and V3 (a completely different animal with a large daughter-card and serial & parallel I/O) so I don't know if the utilities will work with your V2 either.

m

per
December 11th, 2008, 07:30 AM
Hi per:

I got your PM and I'll gladly send you what I have, but you'll probably be disappointed.

I just looked at the manual and it doesn't mention the jumpers or auxiliary connectors at all (!); the cards I have are V1 and V3 (a completely different animal with a large daughter-card and serial & parallel I/O) so I don't know if the utilities will work with your V2 either.

m

Pictures please...

My card looks like this (it's not my card, but it looks the same):
http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~idr/graphics/Small_Wonder_card.jpg

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 08:19 AM
Geez, now you want pictures! I shoulda stayed out of this... ;-)

per
December 11th, 2008, 08:23 AM
Geez, now you want pictures! I shoulda stayed out of this... ;-)

Ver. 1 is the most similar (same chipset). Can you type the specs. & settings for it? The software would also be great. The only difference is the Chips count (one extra TTL and a coupple of extra Resistors on ver. 1)

*Edit*
Sorry, the Chips AND Resistor count is the same. My mistake. The only difference seems to be the organizion of the components and the fact that it uses DIP RAM instead of surface mount RAM.

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 08:49 AM
Ver. 1 is the most similar (same chipset). Can you type the specs. & settings for it? The software would also be great. The only difference is the Chips count (one extra TTL and a coupple of extra Resistors on ver. 1)
-----------
Looks pretty well identical to me; 3 TTLs to interface to the bus etc., 2 memory chips, the ATI 18700 and a ROM/EPROM (and a transistor to drive the composite out). The number of resistors etc. is different among my V1 cards anyway.

Having trouble reading the disk; you may be SOL.

mike

per
December 11th, 2008, 08:52 AM
-----------
Looks pretty well identical to me; 3 TTLs to interface to the bus etc., 2 memory chips, the ATI 18700 and a ROM/EPROM (and a transistor to drive the composite out). The number of resistors etc. is different among my V1 cards anyway.

Having trouble reading the disk; you may be SOL.

mike

and the manual or box doesn't say anything about switch settings or graphic modes supported?

MikeS
December 11th, 2008, 09:07 AM
I'm going to start a new thread with a more appropriate subject; see ATI Graphics Solution.

Chuck(G)
December 11th, 2008, 02:54 PM
I looked around and the best programming reference that I could find is an old MGA "clone" manual. I scanned it and you can download it here (http://www.sydex.com/temp/hgcman.zip).

If you need more, let me know. I'll leave the file up until Monday.