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TandyMan100
September 24th, 2009, 10:06 AM
I have a VGA IBM PS/2 Monitor (grey/biege) connected to my MS-DOS/windows3.1 machine. I also have a 1mb paradise vga video card. I installed teh paradise vga drivers, and it worked fine on my more modern monitor, but the IBM monitor just showed staticky, liney, crap. Same with LCARS24.

Also, why can most DOS apps (wolf3d and terminal velocity, for example) use 256+ colors without any special drivers, yet Windows 3.1 cannot?

linuxlove
September 24th, 2009, 10:31 AM
the first thing that would come to my mind is maybe that the refresh rate is too high for the IBM monitor to handle? maybe the screen resolution is too much for the screen. I'm not an expert, but those would be the first things I would check.

krebizfan
September 24th, 2009, 10:49 AM
The old IBM 851x monitors were fixed frequency. The 8512 and 8513 both did 640x480 at 60Hz while the 8514 added 1024x768 at some strange Hz value. 800x600 and many other useful standards are not supported by those monitors. There is a DIP switch setting on my Paradise card that is specific to the PS/2 monitor. Set that switch and maybe the monitor will work better.

The DOS apps include a driver that handles the color regime. I thought most DOS games went for a low resolution 320x200 with 256 colors which runs on almost any VGA or MCGA card while Windows really needs the highest resolution possible even if it means sacrificing colors.

kishy
September 24th, 2009, 04:14 PM
I may be going WAY out on a limb here...

I believe, though info online is a bit sketchy, MCGA used the VGA connector. Are you positive it's a VGA monitor? A couple early PS/2s (I think 25 and 30, with the 30 being the one using an external monitor) were MCGA which might explain this issue.

I'm a little 'out of my mind' from not feeling well right now, so take it easy on me if I missed something obvious.

cheers

IBMMuseum
September 24th, 2009, 04:34 PM
I may be going WAY out on a limb here...

I believe, though info online is a bit sketchy, MCGA used the VGA connector. Are you positive it's a VGA monitor? A couple early PS/2s (I think 25 and 30, with the 30 being the one using an external monitor) were MCGA which might explain this issue.

I'm a little 'out of my mind' from not feeling well right now, so take it easy on me if I missed something obvious.

It's true that the 8086 versions of the Model 25 and Model 30 had MCGA video on the planar (the 286+ versions had VGA), but there is no such thing as a MCGA monitor. Windows 3.1 wouldn't run on those versions anyway. I've run Windows 3.0 in Real mode on an 8086 Model 30, and you can only have monochrome through MCGA or VGA (with an add-in card).

kishy
September 24th, 2009, 04:44 PM
It's true that the 8086 versions of the Model 25 and Model 30 had MCGA video on the planar (the 286+ versions had VGA), but there is no such thing as a MCGA monitor. Windows 3.1 wouldn't run on those versions anyway. I've run Windows 3.0 in Real mode on an 8086 Model 30, and you can only have monochrome through MCGA or VGA (with an add-in card).

Oops, right you are. Sorry! *cough, sneeze*

Fallo
September 24th, 2009, 08:05 PM
It's true that the 8086 versions of the Model 25 and Model 30 had MCGA video on the planar (the 286+ versions had VGA), but there is no such thing as a MCGA monitor.

MCGA was basically just cut-down VGA. It had the CGA modes, plus the 320x200x256 and 640x480 monochrome VGA modes, but no EGA or 640x480 color. And as far as I know, all Model 30s (286 version included) have MCGA and not full VGA.


Windows 3.1 wouldn't run on those versions anyway. I've run Windows 3.0 in Real mode on an 8086 Model 30, and you can only have monochrome through MCGA or VGA (with an add-in card).

Right, because the color EGA and VGA drivers in Windows 3.x contain 286 instructions. You can of course use them if you have an NEC V20. Windows 2.x's EGA and VGA drivers will work on 8086s, but only give you color menus and window boxes. The actual graphics in programs will still be monochrome.

IBMMuseum
September 24th, 2009, 09:11 PM
...And as far as I know, all Model 30s (286 version included) have MCGA and not full VGA...

There are two planars used interchangably on the 25 286 and 30 286. They have the same VGA chip (15F6864) used on the Model 50Z and other PS/2 models. You can also review any of the Model 30 286 announcement letters from IBM, like http://www.ibmmuseum.com/ohlandl/8530/189-035.txt (there is even a stock IBM PS/2 Model 25SX, using a 386SX, that has a TI SVGA controller, with 512Kb of VRAM).


...Right, because the color EGA and VGA drivers in Windows 3.x contain 286 instructions. You can of course use them if you have an NEC V20. Windows 2.x's EGA and VGA drivers will work on 8086s, but only give you color menus and window boxes. The actual graphics in programs will still be monochrome.

In this case it would be the V30, because it replaces an 8086 in those versions of the Model 25 and Model 30...