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CP/M User
August 17th, 2005, 01:36 AM
It's funny that when you think of people like Del Shannon, people generally think about the hits he had in the early 1960s - with songs like Runaway, The Swiss Maid, Hat's off to Larry, Little Town Flirt & the other big hit he had in 1965 - Keep Searchin' (Follow the Sun). But after that the hits kind of dried up - even though he was producing some interesting stuff.

The Andrew Loog Oldham sessions are perhaps the most interesting (in 1967). This involved Shannon going over to the UK & doing some acoustic sound. It was in this period a revamped version of Runaway - with some very interesting results (if anyone knows Don McLean's Castle's in the Air - the circumstances are simular, in which a slower reworked version was made - many years after the Tapestry version).

Some other songs Shannon perform from these sessions, which have an interesting sound to them, come from guy called Billy Nicholls (English) - in the form of Cut & Come Again, Friendly With You & Led Along.
An Amazon search reveals this guy has some CDs to his name - as well as some album done in that period, which wasn't released until 1999!
Strange to see though that 2 (I think) of the 3 songs Shannon sings aren't on any of the Nicholls (there's a song on one of them called Come Again - which maybe Cut & Come Again - from the Shannon CD).
At least one person reckons the Nicholls album (that wasn't released on Vinyl until 1999) was the UKs answer to Pet Sounds. It's interesting to note that the Shannon sessions were definitely influenced from this album. Yet Pet Sounds (from the Beach Boys - produced by Brian Wilson), is also underrated in a way - yet drew influence! :-)

It's also interesting to note that the Shannon album to be (Home & Away) from the Oldham sessions wasn't released until the late 1970s & appearning on the Liberty Years CD in 1990s. Unforuntely it seems pretty hard to track - perhaps no longer produced I suspect.

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Terry Yager
August 17th, 2005, 07:06 AM
And you'll never hear surf music again!

--T

CP/M User
August 18th, 2005, 01:25 AM
"Jimi Hendrix" wrote:

> And you'll never hear surf music again!

Well if you actually think about this, this dude passed out circa 1970 and Surf Music did come back in the 1980s. Even the Beach Boys came back doing their usual stuff & had a hit in the late 80s (remember Cocktail - with Tom Cruise).

I remember some other group from the early '80s (1984?) doing a cover of an early Beach Boys song. The way I see it, any music has a way of re-emerging - esp. Folk! :-)

Good to some various results from the poll - hope I get more.

Might of started this before, but being some sort of 1960s musical freek it's a bit hard to resist saying you can only limit yourself to the Hits. Most of my early collections are from groups which consist a lot of hits - with a few other non-hit interesting songs (or lesser hits). For some reason I thought I had a definitive Del Shannon album with all his hits, but then just by chance the radio decided to play Runaway '67 (or I think it might of been a live version of Runaway '67?), which just blew me away. I had to see what this guy was all about by getting this 2CD Complete Career Anthology (1961-1990) which reveals a lot of everything about him. Strangely enought it has Stereo Versions of his early songs like Runaway, Hat's Off To Larry, Hey Little Girl, Little Town Flirt & Keep Searchin' (Follow the Sun) etc.

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Mad-Mike
August 18th, 2005, 01:26 PM
I remember some other group from the early '80s (1984?) doing a cover of an early Beach Boys song.


I think that was Van-Halen's David Lee Roth after he left Van-Halen. He covered "California Girls" on his 1985 album "Crazy From The Heat". In the video he would run around on some wooden walkway acting nuts around all these bikini clad hotties.

CP/M User
August 18th, 2005, 02:18 PM
"Mad-Mike" wrote:

> I think that was Van-Halen's David Lee Roth after he left Van-Halen. He
> covered "California Girls" on his 1985 album "Crazy From The Heat". In
> the video he would run around on some wooden walkway acting nuts
> around all these bikini clad hotties.

Yeah could of been that, not very familiar of him, just vagerly remember the song from the hit parade many moon ago (didn't realise it was as late as 1985).

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Terry Yager
August 18th, 2005, 04:27 PM
Many people have interpreted Third Stone From The Sun as a rant against Surf Music, when in fact, it was Hendrix's tribute to Dick Dale, and the influence he had on Jimi's own gituar style. (Dale played his Fender upside-down and left-handed, as did Hendrix).

http://www.history-of-rock.com/dick_dale_and_the_deltones.htm

--T

Terry Yager
August 18th, 2005, 04:44 PM
Even the Beach Boys came back doing their usual stuff & had a hit in the late 80s (remember Cocktail - with Tom Cruise).

I remember some other group from the early '80s (1984?) doing a cover of an early Beach Boys song. The way I see it, any music has a way of re-emerging - esp. Folk! :-)

The Beach Boys are to Surf Music what Elvis was to "Negro Blues"...at best, a blatant rip-off, and at worst, a piss-poor imitation.
Del Shannon is closer to real surf music than The Beach Boys will ever be.
[/rant]

--T

DimensionDude
August 18th, 2005, 06:51 PM
More trivia about Dick Dale, he didn't re-string his guitar as some other left handed players did. This is what lead to the "Dick Dale" sound. Still sounds great after all these years!

CP/M User
August 18th, 2005, 11:26 PM
"Terry Yager" Wrote:

> The Beach Boys are to Surf Music what Elvis was to "Negro Blues"...at
> best, a blatant rip-off, and at worst, a p!$$-poor imitation.

> Del Shannon is closer to "real" surf music than The Beach Boys will
> ever be.

How did you figure that one out?

Del Shannon is one of the early Rock 'n' Rollers yes, but I don't hear one Surf Song to his name! Del Shannon doesn't seem to perform Surf stuff in his Solo Career, the only connection I can make is Surf seems to follow some of the old Rock 'n' Roll riffs - in a poppy way.

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Terry Yager
August 21st, 2005, 05:55 PM
It's kinda hard to explain...
Surf music is less a sound than a feeling, and you have to experience it first-hand to understand it.

The only "rules" I can think of are:

a) Surf music doesn't have to be about surfing,
and
b) Songs about surfing ain't necessarilly always surf music.

c) Surf music seldom appears on anybody's Top-Anything List.

Surfin' USA ain't.

Wipe-out is.

Louie Louie by The Kingsmen is,
but
Louie Louie by Paul Revere & the Raiders ain't.

And yes, surf music has made several comebacks over the years, usually going by different names, but the same feeling.

Punk-rock is.

Grunge-rock is.

Garage is.

I dunno...it's sum'n like that, but not that exactly...
Mebbe it's just one of those things that everyone has to interpret for themself.

--T

CP/M User
August 23rd, 2005, 01:38 AM
"Terry Yager" wrote:

> It's kinda hard to explain...
> Surf music is less a sound than a feeling, and you have to experience it
> first-hand to understand it.

> The only "rules" I can think of are:

> a) Surf music doesn't have to be about surfing,
> and
> b) Songs about surfing ain't necessarilly always surf music.

> c) Surf music seldom appears on anybody's Top-Anything List.

> Surfin' USA ain't.

> Wipe-out is.

> Louie Louie by The Kingsmen is,
> but Louie Louie by Paul Revere & the Raiders ain't.

> And yes, surf music has made several comebacks over the years,
> usually going by different names, but the same feeling.

> Punk-rock is.

> Grunge-rock is.

> Garage is.

> I dunno...it's sum'n like that, but not that exactly...
> Mebbe it's just one of those things that everyone has to interpret for
> themself.

Not really familiar with Grunge-rock - is it an old thing (40 years ago) or more recent. I'm thinking that Garage is along the same lines & not some group out in the back shed strutting their stuff.

I know what you mean about Wipeout, it's no pop song which plays along the lines of Rock 'n' Roll with virtually no vocals (except for that Chuckle & then Wipeout).

Some people here actually regard Louie, Louie as the best song from the 60s - I'm not all that impressed at it.

When I actually hit the books again, was a bit clearer that The Beach Boys aren't dubbed as a surf based group.

Punk Rock is a suprise entry, I've got a copy of The Stranglers which I guess you could call them that.

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Mad-Mike
August 23rd, 2005, 07:00 PM
The only thing surf I see about Punk/Grunge/Garage music are the guitars some of these guys use. At one time the Fender Jaguar/Jazzmaster were considered "surf guitars", now they are identified by Nirvana and Bush, go figure. As far as the sound, it's way different, I mean waaay different. Surf music was usually clean tones, filled with reverb. To me, I don't really care, If I like the sound I'll listen to it. I mainley listen to 80's hair metal and old Van-Halen.

CP/M User
August 25th, 2005, 01:24 AM
"Mad-Mike" wrote:

> The only thing surf I see about Punk/Grunge/Garage music are the
> guitars some of these guys use. At one time the Fender
> Jaguar/Jazzmaster were considered "surf guitars", now they are
> identified by Nirvana and Bush, go figure.

Never heard of Bush, but I must of heard at least one Nirvana song, Heavy Metal I suppose you'd call it - unfortunately I can't seem to grasp any of the tunes they might of played, most of the time I'm thinking how much I hate it! :-( But you'd think that if there were an old instrument in that pack, it would be reconisiable.

> As far as the sound, it's way different, I mean waaay different. Surf
> music was usually clean tones, filled with reverb. To me, I don't really
> care, If I like the sound I'll listen to it. I mainley listen to 80's hair
> metal and old Van-Halen.

Guess it's the way it's played.

I mean one of current musicians I enjoy hearning is Pete Murray (have you heard of him?), the sound hit me straight away - in that him & his group seem to play a range of instruments with familiar sound. Perhaps it's all in the tuning of the instrument? That's what I'm thinking at least. Even his concert on DVD seems has that sound, even when he want's to do some metal bit with the Guitar.

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Terry Yager
August 25th, 2005, 04:01 PM
The only thing surf I see about Punk/Grunge/Garage music are the guitars some of these guys use. At one time the Fender Jaguar/Jazzmaster were considered "surf guitars", now they are identified by Nirvana and Bush, go figure. As far as the sound, it's way different, I mean waaay different. Surf music was usually clean tones, filled with reverb. To me, I don't really care, If I like the sound I'll listen to it. I mainley listen to 80's hair metal and old Van-Halen.

Yeah, the gituars and heavy reverb are pretty much definitive of surf, but there's more to it than that. The melodic interpretation has a lot to do with the surf sound.
I'm with you though, if I like it, I listen to it. (Just to give you an idea of my "wierd" musical tastes, so far today, I've played a Patsy Cline tape, a Bob Marley tape, and two Frank Zappa CDs).

--T

Terry Yager
August 25th, 2005, 04:13 PM
[quote="CP/M User"]Not really familiar with Grunge-rock - is it an old thing (40 years ago) or more recent. I'm thinking that Garage is along the same lines & not some group out in the back shed strutting their stuff.

Grunge is a sound that originated in the Seatile, WA area in the late 80's - early 90's. Garage music originally came from the East Coast area, and yes, it was all about renting a vacant warehouse, and throwing a party (an early version of the "rave", but with live music instead of (whatever they play today) recordings), also from the early 90's.

--T

Mad-Mike
August 25th, 2005, 06:51 PM
Yeah, the gituars and heavy reverb are pretty much definitive of surf, but there's more to it than that. The melodic interpretation has a lot to do with the surf sound.
I'm with you though, if I like it, I listen to it. (Just to give you an idea of my "wierd" musical tastes, so far today, I've played a Patsy Cline tape, a Bob Marley tape, and two Frank Zappa CDs).

--T


That's not all that weird, I listen to 80's acts that make some people blush, like the Canadian act Loverboy and even Winger, yet along with that, I listen to Ray Stevens, Iron Maiden, Metallica, and The Police. Funny thing with The Police is that's my favorite music to work on old computers to, especially the Ghost in the Machine album.

CP/M User
August 26th, 2005, 01:30 AM
"Terry Yager" wrote:

> I'm with you though, if I like it, I listen to it. (Just to give you an idea of
> my "wierd" musical tastes, so far today, I've played a Patsy Cline tape,
> a Bob Marley tape, and two Frank Zappa CDs).

I've collected a lot of the stuff from 50s Rock & Roll to some of the 80s Sounds. But in more recent times I've been collecting stuff which have ties to some of this. The Byrds for example have ties with all sorts of Artists which have been associated with - it may not all being interesting to myself, but having snippets of Artists stuff which have been associated with the Byrds (in the form of the Byrd Parts Compilation Albums in all 2 so far) - you get a good idea what sounds interesting & what maybe less so. So far I've collected stuff from Gene Clark (solo as well as snippets from the Dillard & Clark Expedition and the Echoes CD which has the complete Gene Clark & The Gosdin Brothers album he made with them on), Gram Parsons, an interesting album from David Hemmings & The Rose Garden (which has a couple of songs Gene Clark gave to them) - which only had one album and a top twenty hit "Next Plane to London" (in 1967).
But since the name Pete Seeger has popped his imprint onto some sixties stuff, I've been collecting his stuff - have one album which has tracks from around the world & a CD of stuff he did between 1944-50 which has stuff from The Union Boys & The Weavers.
But now this Del Shannon CD has some interesting stuff on it too - particularly the Oldham Sessions, which has this accoustic sound to it - which I just love - I might go and try get some Billy Nicholls stuff now - but it would have been nice if I could hear some snippets from Amazon site, but they don't seen to have any (even though they have a few CDs!)-:

Yeah, there's a bit of a emerging pattern which I'm sure you could all see for yourselves - I could chuck in all sorts of stuff at you though, which at one point I liked. Unfortunately it includes 70s disco (if I can call it that! ;-) and big hits which I've heard to death turn me off (The Rolling Stones -"Satisfaction" for instance) - other rock I seem to like - e.g. The Yardbirds, Pink Floyd.
Then there's other crooner based stuff - at the moment I don't have much, apart from Matt Munro & Andy Williams. Which make having Perry Como collections desirable (there's so much to him though!).

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CP/M User
September 13th, 2005, 04:04 AM
"CP/M User" Wrote:

> It's also interesting to note that the Shannon album to be (Home &
> Away) from the Oldham sessions wasn't released until the late 1970s &
> appearning on the Liberty Years CD in 1990s. Unforuntely it seems
> pretty hard to track - perhaps no longer produced I suspect.

YEAH!!! I found that Album in question on CD! :-))

Just ordered it off Amazon (US) - it's called "And the music plays on" released in 1978 which has all of the Oldham sessions plus another 4 tracks. This CD (made by BGO Records) comprises of two Vinyl albums stuck onto one CD - so it's fills a good portion of the CD. The other album is Del Shannon Live in England.

Amazon has samples track snippets (for the whole 28 tracks on the album) if anyone was curious to have a listen. It'll sound better having the CD though! :-)

CP/M User.

CP/M User
October 9th, 2005, 02:54 PM
"CP/M User" Wrote:

> YEAH!!! I found that Album in question on CD! :-))

YEAH! I just got my CD the other day! Quite interesting!

The live in England album (with all his Hit stuff live) was good too,
suprised he didn't perform Stranger in Town though, he did do "Keep
Searchin' (Follow the Sun)" though, as well as a couple suprise entries,
like "Crying" as well as a couple of other songs unknown to me.

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