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piplol
August 15th, 2011, 11:37 AM
Well i think its the keyboard that is causing all the problems since it goes directly to a 301 44 error, and when it starts up, it goes directly to ROM basic and starts typing gibberish, also the speaker keeps beeping whilst all that is happening. Once i start typing on the keyboard it stops and runs basic normally. So i unplugged the keyboard to see if it would boot dos, then it displays just 301 and goes to basic.With that being said i tried turning the computer on, with just a random disk in the drive, when i did that, the drive recognized it wasn't a system disk and asked me to put in the dos start up disk, and a course when i plug the keyboard in, it goes about the same routine as mentioned above, I suppose what i am asking is. Should the 5150 be able to boot the dos start up disk without a keyboard?

any help will be very much appreciated

RWallmow
August 15th, 2011, 12:02 PM
Well i think its the keyboard that is causing all the problems since it goes directly to a 301 44 error, and when it starts up, it goes directly to ROM basic and starts typing gibberish, also the speaker keeps beeping whilst all that is happening. Once i start typing on the keyboard it stops and runs basic normally. So i unplugged the keyboard to see if it would boot dos, then it displays just 301 and goes to basic.With that being said i tried turning the computer on, with just a random disk in the drive, when i did that, the drive recognized it wasn't a system disk and asked me to put in the dos start up disk, and a course when i plug the keyboard in, it goes about the same routine as mentioned above, I suppose what i am asking is. Should the 5150 be able to boot the dos start up disk without a keyboard?

any help will be very much appreciated
I don't have a 5150 myself to help you test, but I know other PCs of that age, some will refuse to boot without keyboard and some will boot fine (except for 301 error), so that could go either way, sadly I cant really help on that front.

However one thing about your keyboard I must ask, is it an AT or PC/XT mode Keyboard? You have any model number on the keyboard? I ask because an AT keyboard hooked to an PC/XT will NOT work. There are some keyboards out there (NON IBM Brand) that are switchable for either mode, but as a rule of thumb, an AT keyboard will NOT work on a PC/XT. If you need an PC/XT style keyboard, I would check out ebay, or look into the XT Keyboard converter kits (made by other members of this forum) (http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/showthread.php?15907-AT-to-XT-Keyboard-Converter)

Also keep in mind 360k boot disks aren't the most reliable things in the world, so (other than the keyboard problem) it could all be just a bad boot disk. I have converted most of my 5.25" floppy based systems to a 3.5" drive due to reliability and availability of good drives and media (though I keep the 5.25 drives around for historical accuracy, so machines can be put back to completely stock). You CAN install a modern 3.5" floppy drive in the PX/XT machines, it will just operate as a 720k floppy (so tape over the HD hole on 1.44m's, or buy 720k media so you can read/write them on modern PCs).

RetroHacker_
August 15th, 2011, 12:15 PM
As RWallmow said, you need an XT type keyboard for a 5150. An AT type keyboard, or a PS/2 keyboard with an AT adapter will not work. It's also possible that your keyboard is just bad. You should be able to boot in to BASIC and type in programs, even if you don't have a boot disk.



Also keep in mind 360k boot disks aren't the most reliable things in the world, so (other than the keyboard problem) it could all be just a bad boot disk. I have converted most of my 5.25" floppy based systems to a 3.5" drive due to reliability and availability of good drives and media

Huh? I've found 360k drives and disks to be very reliable. More so than 3 1/2" media. You just have to use actual 360k diskettes, and not 1.2mb disks. And taping over the hole on 1.44mb floppies to format them as 720K is *NOT* a reliable method. The magnetic coercivity of the media is different. While it might work for a while, it won't work in the long run.

-Ian

DOS lives on!!
August 15th, 2011, 12:24 PM
I've found 360k drives and disks to be very reliable. More so than 3 1/2" media. You just have to use actual 360k diskettes, and not 1.2mb disks. And taping over the hole on 1.44mb floppies to format them as 720K is *NOT* a reliable method. The magnetic coercivity of the media is different. While it might work for a while, it won't work in the long run.
I have some 360k disks from 1982 and they're still going strong. Now, I've taped over the hole on 3 1/2 disks and haven't seen a problem. One of my taped over disks from about four years ago is still good.

Piplol, which of these do you have hooked up? XT, AT, or Enhanced.

RWallmow
August 15th, 2011, 01:01 PM
As RWallmow said, you need an XT type keyboard for a 5150. An AT type keyboard, or a PS/2 keyboard with an AT adapter will not work. It's also possible that your keyboard is just bad. You should be able to boot in to BASIC and type in programs, even if you don't have a boot disk.



Huh? I've found 360k drives and disks to be very reliable. More so than 3 1/2" media. You just have to use actual 360k diskettes, and not 1.2mb disks. And taping over the hole on 1.44mb floppies to format them as 720K is *NOT* a reliable method. The magnetic coercivity of the media is different. While it might work for a while, it won't work in the long run.

-Ian
I do not think I have a single PC 360k disk that has survived, plenty of 1.2m disks still kicking though, and I agree on the tape over HD hole on 3.5", not a permanent solution, but might get you by in a pinch, I actually have something like 200 NOS 720k disks, so I don't personally use that trick anymore, but I had in the past.

pearce_jj
August 15th, 2011, 01:14 PM
I would suggest checking the wire first. Open the keyboard (simply two screws on the back, assuming its a real IBM PC keyboard) and use a multimeter to check continuity (i.e. connection) between each of the pins in the connector and their respective end points (there is a connector inside). All pins, and the outer plug surround, should have exactly one connection at the other end.

Hope that helps!

Chuck(G)
August 15th, 2011, 01:32 PM
A 5150 will boot without a keyboard., IIRC You'll get the error, but then it should continue.

At least that's according to my memory.

pearce_jj
August 15th, 2011, 01:34 PM
That is correct, at least with the rev.3 BIOS.

piplol
August 15th, 2011, 06:44 PM
Well as far as i can tell its the xt keyboard 83 keys, can't find model number, it is not on the outside or in the inside. The original one i had " witch is beyond hope" had a sticker inside of the key board that said IBM and said model F, my current keyboard has the same layout, but lacks the sticker that my original one had. Well i suppose i will just get another keyboard, also haven't thought about putting a 3.5 drive in it, i have a copy of dos 4.0 laying around so i might just pick me up another 3.5 this weekend. Thx's for the info

bettablue
August 15th, 2011, 08:15 PM
Silly of me to ask, but during my last session of swapping drives, I accidentally pluged the keyboard into the cassette port. I got the same error, but more importantly, it really sounds like you have a wire shorted out like pearce jj mentioned. There also could be something shortin out a connection on the keyboard's inards. The backplate is steel, and if any of the wires or contact meet up with the backplate, it would cause a short as well. The last thing to consider is a bad controller board in the keyboard itself. I am a member of Geekhack forums, a group revolving around all things keyboard. They can surely help you figure it out too.

Hope this helps.