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WMH
August 20th, 2012, 04:04 PM
(Mods, feel free to move this if it doesn't belong.)

Hey guys,

Just acquired my first Mac today, an iMac (G3.) It's pretty awesome, and it even has OS 9.2 on the hard drive. But, as usual, I don't have the password to log on.

So, I downloaded a copy of OS 9, and tried burning it with Windows Disk Image Burner in Win 7. Error. Tried Power2Go. Error. Then I tried ImgBurn. Success! Excitedly, I plugged in the disc, booted the iMac, then held c to boot from disk.

And right now, I'm sitting at a blank gray screen. Nothing's happening...

So, what to do? Bad ISO image, bad CD, bad burning program, or bad iMac? (By the way, if you didn't catch it earlier, the iMac DOES boot to its hard drive OK.)

I'd love to hear your opinion, I'm a n00b when it comes to Mac stuff.

Thanks again, guys.

commodorejohn
August 20th, 2012, 04:07 PM
Sometimes it depends on which version of OS9 you're using, though that's usually more of an issue with newer hardware. Was the image you downloaded an ISO, or was it a DMG image file? The latter is Apple-proprietary, and I don't know of any PC tools that can burn it.

WMH
August 20th, 2012, 04:18 PM
Sometimes it depends on which version of OS9 you're using, though that's usually more of an issue with newer hardware. Was the image you downloaded an ISO, or was it a DMG image file? The latter is Apple-proprietary, and I don't know of any PC tools that can burn it.

It's OS 9.2.1, and an ISO image.

WMH
August 20th, 2012, 04:39 PM
Does anyone know where I can get a better image burner for Widows? Or is that not my problem here?

commodorejohn
August 20th, 2012, 04:43 PM
That's likely not the problem. The issue is probably that most 9.2x CDs are non-bootable update-only disks, and you likely got one. I would just find yourself a 9.0.1 disk, install from that (make sure not to install any Language Kits, as they completely changed how those work in between 9 and 9.2,) and apply the updates from there.

DOS lives on!!
August 20th, 2012, 04:45 PM
When all else fails, use ImgBurn. Works every time for me.

I have an OS9 disc, and it does the same thing you're talking about. It loads to a "Mac face" background, and then just stays there. Maybe it's supposed to be a boot disk? No menu bars appear at the top.

I did finally "find" a download for an OS9 disc that actually boots to the installer program. And yes it is burnable by ImgBurn.

WMH
August 20th, 2012, 05:08 PM
When all else fails, use ImgBurn. Works every time for me.

I have an OS9 disc, and it does the same thing you're talking about. It loads to a "Mac face" background, and then just stays there. Maybe it's supposed to be a boot disk? No menu bars appear at the top.

I did finally "find" a download for an OS9 disc that actually boots to the installer program. And yes it is burnable by ImgBurn.

May I ask where this download was? ;)

EDIT: Never mind, found a new ISO download. I'll post an update on how it goes.

WMH
August 20th, 2012, 06:29 PM
...Never mind, found a new ISO download. I'll post an update on how it goes.

It was a no go, basically a blank download...

All I could find was a .dmg otherwise.

Anyone got a spare ISO or download URL lying around? Is it possible to convert DMG to ISO?

commodorejohn
August 20th, 2012, 06:36 PM
I'd ask around at Macintosh Garden; (http://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macintosh-system-922-1021-power-macintosh-g4-mirrored-drive-doors-mdd#iMac_CD-ROMs) they were rather crippled by the whole MegaUpload government vengeance-raid fiasco, but a lot of them still have files that they're willing to share.

Old Thrashbarg
August 20th, 2012, 06:47 PM
Anyone got a spare ISO or download URL lying around? Is it possible to convert DMG to ISO?

If you want, I could do you one better and mail you a copy. You're in Florida so it wouldn't take more than a day or two to arrive, I'd imagine.

RickNel
August 20th, 2012, 10:22 PM
But, as usual, I don't have the password to log on.

So, I downloaded a copy of OS 9, and tried burning it with Windows Disk Image Burner in Win 7. Error. Tried Power2Go. Error. Then I tried ImgBurn. Success! Excitedly, I plugged in the disc, booted the iMac, then held c to boot from disk.

And right now, I'm sitting at a blank gray screen. Nothing's happening...



I went through exactly this scenario recently with a different Mac model (iBook G3 Clamshell), and found a solution.

Your downloaded ISO is very likely OK. The problem is that burning a HFS filesystem ISO on a Windows machine seems to result in a boot sector that your iMac won't recognise. I tried ImgBurn and others, always the same result.

1. If you can get access to a Mac G3, G4 or G5 with a CD burner you can burn that ISO file to CD using the Mac "Disk Utility", and 10:1 it will turn out bootable. I used a G4 eMac for that.

2. Alternately, if your G3 has a Combo drive, try to borrow an OSX <10.3.x Install CDROM. Boot your G3 from that by holding down "C" at the chime.

3. At the Install options screen, use the Installer menu option to "Reset Password" on your G3, and you can then create new passwords to the existing installed system and any existing user accounts.

4. Boot into the reset existing system with your new password, mount the non-booting ISO CD and copy it to your G3 desktop.

5. Then use the Disk Utility on your existing system to burn a copy of that ISO to a new disk.

6. You should then be able to reboot from that new CD Install, and do either an upgrade or a full install.

7. Depending on the configuration and the gaps between what is installed and OS 9.2.1, you might find that you can do the upgrade directly from the ISO on the desktop, without burning a new CD. However it is obviously better to have a bootable install CD to hand, because you need it for maintenance as well as for fresh install purposes.

I think you will definitely need access either to a working Mac with a CD burner, or an Install CD for a G3 compatible MacOSX - nothing above 10.3.9.

If you can't get access to a working Mac or compatible OSX Install disk, there are other more radical ways to break into the existing installation. They might involve small PPC-Linux based systems that can boot live from CDROM and give you access to the filesystem on your G3's HDD. I don't have the step-by-step instructions, but I have seen them and they can be found by some assiduous searching of Apple user forums (not the Apple.com "support" forums which usually recommend buying a new Apple product).

I'm sure it is doable, with patience.

Rick

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 03:07 AM
Wow, Rick, thanks for the suggestions!

I've got access to lots and lots of Intel iMacs at a place near me (but not at my house, I'm a die-hard PC user with modern stuff. When it comes to vintage, I like Apple, thus, my avatar.) Is that where I ought to start? Or should I track down a G4 or G5 first?

DOS lives on!!
August 21st, 2012, 03:19 AM
Ah, that's it! My mistake, I was thinking of something else. You DO have to burn it on a Mac. You can download the image on a Windows PC, and then transfer it to a Mac, then burn the image to the CD using Disk Utility. It has a built-in burning feature.

RWallmow
August 21st, 2012, 04:01 AM
Ah, that's it! My mistake, I was thinking of something else. You DO have to burn it on a Mac. You can download the image on a Windows PC, and then transfer it to a Mac, then burn the image to the CD using Disk Utility. It has a built-in burning feature.

I have burned OS9 discs on a PC before, most PC applications wont pull it off correctly, but it was either poweriso or ultraiso, I forget which, that allowed me to burn a bootable MacOS CDs (I have made 8.1 up through OSX).

This was for my beige G3, I do seem to recall however that early iMacs and iBooks may have required special OS9 CDs. This did NOT hold true for my beige G3, it would boot anything I tossed in it (that was burned correctly), so this may or may not help you.

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 05:07 AM
Alright, I'll burn a disk on a Mac and get back later this afternoon with the results.

commodorejohn
August 21st, 2012, 07:39 AM
Yeah, if you do have access to a Mac that'd be the easiest solution. For PC burning, I've found that InfraRecorder is pretty good about not trying to "fix" the contents of a disk image for you.

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 12:40 PM
Ugh, I got a floppy disk icon with a blinking "?" when I tried to boot.

What now? Bad ISO? I've got a DMG, what can I do with that?

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 12:56 PM
Wait a second! This system is a single-user setup. Can't the password be reset by resetting PRAM (or something like that) in Open Firmware?

RWallmow
August 21st, 2012, 01:03 PM
Ugh, I got a floppy disk icon with a blinking "?" when I tried to boot.

What now? Bad ISO? I've got a DMG, what can I do with that?

Blinking ? means its sees that there is a disk, but it cant boot it for whatever reason (its not bootable, its corrupt, etc).

I know it is actually possible to disable CD boot with OF (Open Firmware) settings, if its password locked, its possible they went to the trouble to disable CD booting. I have seen this with some school owned devices. That said, I don't recall if they give a ? on blocked attempted boot, or some other error/icon. If it is a case of an OF block on CD/Disk booting, there is a method, albeit not a super easy one, to remove all OF locks/passwords.

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 01:32 PM
How about trying a PRAM Reset? I've got an Apple document that tells me how, should I try it?

commodorejohn
August 21st, 2012, 01:35 PM
No harm in trying, but I doubt that's the problem. If it knows the disk is there but doesn't think it's bootable, it's probably not bootable; is it a machine-specific image?

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 02:01 PM
No harm in trying, but I doubt that's the problem. If it knows the disk is there but doesn't think it's bootable, it's probably not bootable; is it a machine-specific image?

Just tried it, no go. The computer did a little time traveling in 1956, though. :)

What now? The ISO I have is a retail ISO, no idea what that means. Should I try converting the DMG I have to an ISO and burning it in Windows?

commodorejohn
August 21st, 2012, 02:25 PM
If you've got a DMG and access to an Intel Mac, I'd just use Disk Copy there, that's a lot more likely to work than the DMG-to-ISO converters I've encountered.

Exactly what model of iMac is this? G3, you said, but any idea which revision? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac_G3#Models)

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 03:06 PM
If you've got a DMG and access to an Intel Mac, I'd just use Disk Copy there, that's a lot more likely to work than the DMG-to-ISO converters I've encountered.

Exactly what model of iMac is this? G3, you said, but any idea which revision? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac_G3#Models)

It's the tray loading model, in Bondi Blue. Guess I'd better hold onto it, huh?

RickNel
August 21st, 2012, 03:23 PM
Just tried it, no go. The computer did a little time traveling in 1956, though. :)

What now? The ISO I have is a retail ISO, no idea what that means. Should I try converting the DMG I have to an ISO and burning it in Windows?

If you burned the ISO on a later Intel Mac, you may still have a problem with filesystem compatibility. I had success only with an ISO burned on a PPC machine - up to G5. HFS+ has some modifications to permissions and other things that may be snagging the bootability of your ISO.

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 04:32 PM
Dr. Google gave me this: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090520075543AAmhdJi

Valid option? It even mentions a G3. What do you guys think?

EDIT: Alright, I've got my DMG image file ready to go, and I've downloaded the program. I'll post the results later...

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 05:21 PM
Victory is mine! I'm installing Mac OS 9.1 right now.

Thanks for all the help guys.

commodorejohn
August 21st, 2012, 05:27 PM
Awesome! It's a sadly underappreciated OS, in my opinion.

WMH
August 21st, 2012, 05:33 PM
Awesome! It's a sadly underappreciated OS, in my opinion.

I really like it. "OS 9" rolls off the tongue easier in my opinion than "OS X" or "OS Ten." :)

When people tell me OS X and Mac OS are one and the same, I now have evidence to the contrary! :)

RickNel
August 21st, 2012, 06:42 PM
Victory is mine! I'm installing Mac OS 9.1 right now.

Thanks for all the help guys.

Excellent! The result is what counts.

To clarify - which utility did you use, TransMac or dmg2iso? I once used TransMac for a Mac Classic, but found that burning an ISO on a PPC machine worked best for the PPC Mac series.

WMH
August 22nd, 2012, 03:00 AM
I used TransMac, it worked really well.

RWallmow
August 22nd, 2012, 03:23 AM
Very nice, glad to hear you got the iMac booting, I need to pick up an old iMac one of these days too ;-)

keith_r25
February 17th, 2014, 09:33 AM
Hello Old Thrashbarg,
Know this thread is old, but here goes.

I just aquired a g3 with os 8.5.1 and looking for os 9. Looked on the net but no sucess. Would you be willing to mail me a copy?
Will paypal or mail check..
thanks,
Keith