PDA

View Full Version : Things which Offend.



CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 04:41 PM
Speaking of things which Offend - there still seems to be a
riot over that good ol' 60s Sitcom - Hogan's Heros. For
myself, I acknowledge that consentration camps durning WWII
weren't holiday camps - I understand all that. What I can't
understand is why people are still protesting about this show.
It's a SITCOM! Sure it's a bit of a Black Comedy - which Dr.
Strangelove might of started! Funny they don't complain about
all the other comedies which involve or have references to the
War. Faulty Towers, Allo Allo, Dads Army for instance make fun
of the Germans for the use of amusement.

As for Hogan's Heros - if it looks so offensive now, then why
didn't they ban it back then - it was out some 20 years after
the War?!?

Sorry this followed some discussion in Humor - I've started it
here though cause it's more of a rant.

While I acknowledge what happened durning WWII was the same as
some sitcom - it makes me wonder how people of those gens can
possibly assume people don't know different - their's movies,
books & exhibits with victims of those places describing the
horror or Consentration Camps?

I love my 60s sitcoms - also.

CP/M User.

atari2600a
July 15th, 2006, 04:51 PM
Speaking of media that offends, what the heck was up w/ that "FarenheiTH 9/11"!? A documentary about a documentary!? Who cares!? All I've seen in the commercials was angry rednecks yelling at the camera. How does that make it appealing!?

Also, What's up w/ all the crap I've heard about The DaVinci Code!? It's Fiction, not like they're trying to change the text in the bible or something! Also, OF COURSE IT'S NOT GONNA BE AS GOOD AS THE BOOK!!!!! Movies are Never true to books down to the last detail! The Diary of Anne Frank (the Film, not the actual Diary) had plenty of things false about it, but it doesn't make the movie suck does it!?

(Deep Breath) Sorry, as you where saying?

80sFreak
July 15th, 2006, 04:54 PM
I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration , Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion, and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids!

I only just saw that movie for the first time last week! But I did watch it twice before sending it back to Netflix... :D

Cheers,

80sFreak

P.S. I like Hogan's Heroes too... I used to watch it all the time when it was on TV.

CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 05:31 PM
Well now it seems to HH - Veteran's aren't happy with it &
want compensation based on what they went throught when they
saw that particular show - or that's the way I've interpreted
it. Honestly, I think it's their grumble bum ways & war
Veterain payouts over time which has spoilt them & this is
just a hit-out to get more money.

As I said - if the show was a problem, the 60s surely would
have canned it.

CP/M User.

CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 05:36 PM
80sFreak wrote:

> I only just saw that movie for the first time last
> week! But I did watch it twice before sending it back
> to Netflix... :-D

Highly influencial - I think that film was. Read somewhere
that this film gets better with Age. Got the DVD myself & seen
it a couple of times myself, unbeliable! :-D

CP/M User.

Terry Yager
July 15th, 2006, 05:41 PM
It's all about Political Correctness. There are still too many Holocaust Survivors (& thier children) around to find Nazi humor amusing...even when it makes the Nazis appear to be total idjits. We're expected to have put all that WWII stuff behind us today, but I know that my uncle went to hiz grave hating all Japanese people becauze of what a handfull of them had done to him & hiz friends during the war. My father fared a little better. He learned to forgive, but he never forgot hiz wartime experiences.

--T

CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 05:56 PM
Terry Yager wrote:

> It's all about Political Correctness.

Political Correctness has no place in a Sitcom. Someone should
tell those Idjits to leave it on the doorstep before watching
those shows.

> There are still too many Holocaust Survivors (& thier
> children) around to find Nazi humor amusing...even
> when it makes the Nazis appear to be total idjits.
> We're expected to have put all that WWII stuff behind
> us today, but I know that my uncle went to hiz grave
> hating all Japanese people becauze of what a handful
> of them had done to him & hiz friends during the war.
> My father faired a little better, he learned to
> forgive, but he never forgot hiz wartime experiences.

Okay, but what does the rest of the world think?

CP/M User.

atari2600a
July 15th, 2006, 06:01 PM
Wait, I'm confused now. I laugh when there's a Hitler joke on Family Guy, South Park, Robot Chicken, ect... (Especially if they somehow find a way to incorporate Anne Frank (So far I've seen 2 that do that)), is that a bad thing?

Terry Yager
July 15th, 2006, 06:04 PM
Then there's Seinfeld's 'Soup Nazi'...

--T

CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 06:44 PM
'Um, perhaps I've confused myself. No, I'm saying it's great
to take a serious thing & put a funny spin on it. If people
aren't happy with it - don't watch it - doesn't mean it's
hiding the truth.

Personally, I got more displeasure watching The Simpson's when
they came to Australia - so I stopped watching it,
unfortunately I just recently an episode where they went to
Japan - basically the same idea, different venue. I soon
realised it was the same formula as used in for the Australian
episode - so I probably won't watch that episode again either,
but it's funny though cause it didn't give me the same sense
of displeasure straight away, still it didn't take me long
afterwards to cotton onto what the writers have done - not
impressed - still someone obviously likes it - doesn't mean
it's right of course.

Seinfeld is a funny one - I've seen them over/over & over
again countless times, some episodes (like the Soup Nazi) are
classics, others I feel like - what were they thinkin' - like
the time George's Dies after licking all of those envelopes,
people dying in a Sitcom? I just didn't buy the attitude
George & Co. had afterwards, not funny. Occassionally I just
think of the characters in the show with the personal
attitudes as well - Soup Nazi like I said was a classic,
though seems to work in that show, it has taught me that
nobody in that show is normal (even Jerry & Co. have their
Quirks) - which leads me to wonder that no-one in living life
is normal!

CP/M User.

Terry Yager
July 15th, 2006, 06:50 PM
Perhaps a Jewish person has the same feeling when watching a sitcom about life in a concentration camp?

--T

Terry Yager
July 15th, 2006, 06:56 PM
Yes, the Soup Nazi episode is truly a classic, but there are still a number of people who find it offensive.

--T

Unknown_K
July 15th, 2006, 08:00 PM
Hogans heroes was about german prisoner of war camps, specifically for the Europeans and Americans captured while shot down over europe. These camps were NOT concentration camps where people were worked to death or put in gas chambers. They did not put jews in the same camps are western prisoners of war.

If you want to see political incorrectness go watch the original blazing saddles comedy. I can't recall how many times I seen white people in the movie call the black cowboy a N^%$R to his face (some of it was very funny). The movie would never make it to the theaters today.

USSEnterprise
July 15th, 2006, 08:21 PM
Yes, the Soup Nazi episode is truly a classic, but there are still a number of people who find it offensive.

Even worse is the Puerto Rican Day Parade one. That pissed many many people off.

If you want to see political incorrectness go watch the original blazing saddles comedy. I can't recall how many times I seen white people in the movie call the black cowboy a N^%$R to his face (some of it was very funny). The movie would never make it to the theaters today.

IMO, the show that defined what political correctness is not, was All in the Family. Hell, they were allowed to say "God Dammit" and "N****r" on public broadcast TV. Imagine what the FCC would do about that today.

tgunner
July 15th, 2006, 09:42 PM
How about that regular episode of South Park where they say SH1T like... 147 or something times? :o

CP/M User
July 15th, 2006, 11:28 PM
tgunner wrote:

> How about that regular episode of South Park where
> they say SH1T like... 147 or something times? :o

I don't know since the station which had the rights to showed
it, cut the language out. Haven't been in the right mind to
get the DVD just to find out either.

There was a public outcry about this not sure when (late 90s I
believe) to cut the language due to the number which watched
it - it was only screened at 8:30pm! which was part of the
trouble. A few people who watched it at the time thought it
had quite a bit of language - they weren't wild on it either -
but loved the show.

I've only watched a couple of episodes of it since they cut
the language - quite tame. Took a while before this was
actioned.

===

Another show currently under the spotlight is the Aussie Big
Brother. Honestly though, I can't cut that Reality Crap & it
might be tamer than other Countries hosting that show - but
really it's been going on 2000 or something, it's like the
television stations have to insist on those shows. They should
pull the plug before somebody looses an eye or something. I
reckon it's a disease which carries though the way a person
speaks about other people, imagine what it would be doing to
the kids who watch it?

CP/M User.

bbcmicro
July 16th, 2006, 01:27 AM
Another show currently under the spotlight is the Aussie Big
Brother. Honestly though, I can't cut that Reality Crap & it
might be tamer than other Countries hosting that show - but
really it's been going on 2000 or something, it's like the
television stations have to insist on those shows. They should
pull the plug before somebody looses an eye or something. I
reckon it's a disease which carries though the way a person
speaks about other people, imagine what it would be doing to
the kids who watch it?

It's very popular over here, but loard it is boring, offensive and crude. They purposefully choose people who will clash, e.g. a self confessed homosexual and a self confessed homophobe, someone of ethnic minority and a racist, etc. etc. The language is appalling, one woman was in the diary room for 5 minutes and swore 88 times. I sometimes wonder what it would be like if they chose intelligent people. I also wonder how longit will be until someone gets badly hurt, do they have knives in there? It's on Channel 4, E4, E4+1 and takes up hours of airtime that could be used for something good. Well, maybe just another list show (Top 100 letters of the alphabet) but it has to be better than BB.

sfcspanky
July 30th, 2006, 06:05 PM
Speaking of South Park, what about Isaac Hayes (Chef) leaving south park because the show made fun of scientology (of which he is part of). Ironically, he had not objected to every other religion being made fun of on the show.

Unfortunately, I have reached the conclusion that all scientologists are odd like that. Granted, I havent met one (that i know of), so I'm not trying to bash them.


Another instance with south park was in the episodes titled "Cartoon Wars" where they bashed Family Guy and poked fun about showing images of Muhammed.

South Park may be a cartoon (and a moderately offensive one at that), but despite its rough sense of humor it does kinda show how stupid some aspects of society actually are.

carlsson
July 30th, 2006, 06:39 PM
one woman was in the diary room for 5 minutes and swore 88 times.
If she had used 88 different words or phrases, it could've been a bit impressive... Foul language in itself is not amusing, but sometimes if I hear or read someone who continuously invents new curses, it can make me smile. A bit like captain Haddock of the Tintin cartoon, but even more varied. Maybe that is the next generation of a game show. Five contestants will take turns in swearing at eachother, using new words all the time. Anyone who uses one that was already used is eliminated, and so they go until only one remains. In order to win the grand prize, the total amount of curses spoken must reach 100. Do you think there is a TV network somewhere who'd buy this concept?

CP/M User
July 30th, 2006, 07:37 PM
carlsson wrote:

> If she had used 88 different words or phrases, it
> could've been a bit impressive... Foul language in
> itself is not amusing, but sometimes if I hear or
> read someone who continuously invents new curses, it
> can make me smile. A bit like captain Haddock of the
> Tintin cartoon, but even more varied. Maybe that is
> the next generation of a game show. Five contestants
> will take turns in swearing at eachother, using new
> words all the time. Anyone who uses one that was
> already used is eliminated, and so they go until only
> one remains. In order to win the grand prize, the
> total amount of curses spoken must reach 100. Do you
> think there is a TV network somewhere who'd buy this
> concept?

There's a new American Quizshow which is on around Midnight
which goes for 3 hours - I wonder if it's the same show. Never
seen it (unfortunately they were still continuning with Star
Trek - Enterprise, which this show so rudely interupted it -
hopeless), but the TV guide indicates it's an adults show.
It's called Quizmania.

I won't say what Billy Connerly(I've spelt his surname wrong -
oh gawd!!) said when here on a talk show, but he said
something like I don't swear without reason - then he
demonstrated how some people talk & then he went back to the
way he talks & uses Language in the punch lines. Either way he
did it, it was still funny cause of the way he demonstrated
how some people are compared to others. Then he said something
like when I say 'F' I mean there's no other word which
replaces it - so I say 'F'! Quite odd.

dreddnott
August 2nd, 2006, 06:39 AM
carlsson, 100 words of curse? The winner would have to be multilingual, don't you think?

carlsson
August 2nd, 2006, 08:44 AM
Nah, not if you include things to call other people: son of a carrot, one-legged crab, annoying tinhead, roaring busybody and so on. I suppose you can always replace or rearrange some letters in known curse words: thuckyou, go to Hull, pass off, hassole. Maybe it gets silly, but I'm sure a creative mind could come with 100 ways to express your anger (which in most cases is what a curse is for) and people around you would recognize it as curses, even if they never heard the actual word or phrase before.

dreddnott
August 2nd, 2006, 11:45 AM
This is a rant thread, posted in the rants forum, so be understanding.

I suppose everybody's heard about Mel Gibson, charmingly reactionary author of the film "The Passion" which featured quite prominently Catholic mystic wanderings from the actual account of the four Gospels, and his recent encounter with the law enforcement officials of the state of California.

Intoxication with alcohol lowers your inhibitions and brings out your true nature (or at least your subconscious impulses) - I think he meant what he said and I've KNOWN he's thought this way since the Passion was in production and various news agencies interviewed Mel and unearthed a much deeper ideological relationship with his father, Hutton Gibson, a rather infamous Holocaust denier and pre-Vatican II cultist, than had previously been visible to the general population.

I just hope Mel gets thoroughly outed in an age of no consequences, historical revisionism and rising anti-Zionism, and people look at the propaganda film that he created a little more circumspectly.

(I suppose this event weighs a little heavier on my mind than most, as I discovered over the past few months that I'm a full Jew, but I've always been sympathetic in the past)

dpatten
August 2nd, 2006, 12:04 PM
In vino veritas. Or as we say down south, Gibson got likkered up 'n shot 'is mouth off. He clearly has internalized some anti-semitic crap from his father and will doubtless now pay for it. No one will believe his stated aversion to hating Jews any longer. Personally, I liked his "Passion" movie, which you note has non-scriptural elements based on Catholic tradition in it. However, it sure does make it hard for him to deny anti-semitism in it when he says crap like that to a Jewish cop

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 12:15 PM
In veritas, vino...

--T

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 12:38 PM
I dunno if I'm qualified to comment, as I'm completely un-familliar with the incident under discussion (citations, anyone?). I'd just like to mention that sometimes, old habits die hard. I strive to be non-racist, but every once in a while, I find myself 'slipping up' and using the 'N-word', much to my chagrin. Mind you, when my children were growing up, the only word that waz ever banned from thier vocabulary waz that word. I alwayz told them that they could use any words they like, including 'cuss-words', so long as they used them appropriatlely, but there is no appropriate use of that word. Still, I am a product of my upbringing, and, while my father waz a card-carrying liberal, my mother was a 'closet racist', whose true feelings often came thru in her speech.
A little background: The area I grew up in was considered 10% white, 10% Mexican, and 80% black, so I can honestly say that throughout my life, most of my friends, and all of my 'best friends' have been persons of color, but still, that word occaisionally (once every couple of yearz) rears it's ugly head, especially if I've had too much to drink.
I'm neither defending nor condemning Gibson, just making the point that it can happen to the best of us.

--T

dpatten
August 2nd, 2006, 01:46 PM
I dunno if I'm qualified to comment, as I'm completely un-familliar with the incident under discussion (citations, anyone?).

Gibson's exact words to the police officer when he was first pulled over were "You mother f****r. I'm going to f*** you." He also said that he "owns Malibu" and would spend all of his money to "get even with" the officer.
After that tirade came the bombshell "F*****g Jews... The Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world." Gibson then asked the deputy, "Are you a Jew?"

Turns out the cop was.

When a female officer came over Gibson said, "What do you think you're looking at, sugar tits?"

Now, I've overindulged before and metaphorically shown my ass. But this is pretty stupid stuff, particularly for a guy in the crosshairs of the ADL.

It's going to be hard for me to believe his apologies.

BTW, according to the arrest report, it wasn't In vino veritas it was In tequila veritas

I wonder if that has anything to do with it. Tequila has gotten me into every stupid situation I've ever been in related to alcohol. I think the worm has stupid juice in it.

Mad-Mike
August 2nd, 2006, 01:59 PM
Here's my ongoing quasi-rant about it.............

Pollitical Correctness is a waste of brainpower and time. Why should I use up extra CPU cycles that could be used doing something more important just to worry about calling someone a "correct" term! People in general have gone socially retarded, they can't even figure out when a word means something different because of the situation in which it's being used. Oh, heaven forbid you ever make a mistake and actually be human, you could get fired, punished, penalized, sued, hit, slapped, kicked, shot, or whatever. I've had some pretty nasty stuff said to me. Hmm, maybe I shoudl go sue my whole 6th grade classmates, I have some REAL punative damages from that school year, and while I'm at it, how about 7th grade the the school system too! Then I'll never have to work again (sarcasm).

Censorship is a waste of time, people figure out about sex, drugs, violence, cussing, swearing, satan, and all those other "taboo" things anyway through various channels, including many outside of TV, better to get a healthy knowledge of why it's "taboo" and know when/how/where it's appropriate than to hide from it. If we all hid ourselves from naked forest animals, we'd never go outside!

And you can't avoid shit by hiding your face in the sand, and hiding others only makes them morbidly curious to the point that they end up having a problem with it later. I know, from working in the twisted local music scene, more than 2/3ds of the drug users, people abusers, and hard to get along with people came from one of those "protective" households.

As far as I've concerned, since about 1981 or so, the whole worlds been undergoing a huge pussification process or something. People don't have common sense, drive, or brains that god gave a gopher anymore. I have to hear my own generation and the next constantly whine about this and that. Back when I was a kid, apparently I'm the last of the kids that grew up this way, my mom did not say, "oh, you poor thing, I'll put you in a uber-expensive private school where the flowers and sunshine are forever and ever and ever, and no cuss words or spoiled brats will ever harm you", no, I was taught "shit, stand tall and stand up for yourself". And after about 15 years of hiding from that crap in hopes some silly person would take mercey on me and censor out everything and make everything like fantasy land, I finally grew a pair, and life since, has been much happier. Basically, the world needs BALLS.

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 01:59 PM
I dunno, man...I've never actually swallowed the worm (I'm not much of a bug-eater), but I've done plenty of st00pit sh!t while under the influence. I think it's the alchohol, not the worm...

--T

alexkerhead
August 2nd, 2006, 02:09 PM
LOL, I knew Mel was a hater when I was forced to watch that movie "passion of the christ"
This incident only reinforced my opinions of him.

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 02:16 PM
M-M,

I've merged your rant with another current rant, since they were closely related.

--T

dreddnott
August 2nd, 2006, 02:18 PM
I haven't actually *seen* the film yet - but I suppose now I might actually have to. Oy vey...

p.s.: thanks - it's probably better this way. ;)

80sFreak
August 2nd, 2006, 02:49 PM
It is a brutal and violent movie that has a rating of Restricted... but every Christian film review webpage is saying you must see it!... And in the same breath they will tell you *not* to see other R rated movies because they are too violent!.. :( :(

Cheers,

80sFreak

P.S... hmmm.. I think I need to see the uncut version of RoboCop again...!

dpatten
August 2nd, 2006, 03:14 PM
I'd recommend seeing the movie. It's not an exact cut from the first 4 gospels, it has some Catholic traditions included, "Veronica's veil" f'rinstance and the depiction of Mary Magdelene as the woman caught in adultery.

I think the anti-semitic aspect of it is over-emphasized. Gibson shows several members of the Sanhedrin leaving in disgust at the judicial end run that Jesus undergoes. Also, Gibson clearly shows Gentile Roman soldiers as the ones who actually torture and execute Christ. I think he pretty clearly shows that Humanity, not just the Jews, are responsible for the death of Christ.

There is a less gory cut if you are squeamish, its not no-gore, but somewhat less. This is the only problem I had with the movie, the Catholic emphasis on suffering is way over done. you could still have shown the horror of crucifixion without gallons and gallons of fake blood.

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 03:27 PM
It is a brutal and violent movie that has a rating of Restricted... but every Christian film review webpage is saying you must see it!... And in the same breath they will tell you *not* to see other R rated movies because they are too violent!.. :( :(

Cheers,

80sFreak

P.S... hmmm.. I think I need to see the uncut version of RoboCop again...!

Since when has 'consistancy' become a tennant of faith in any religion?

--T

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 03:34 PM
I'd recommend seeing the movie. It's not an exact cut from the first 4 gospels, it has some Catholic traditions included, "Veronica's veil" f'rinstance and the depiction of Mary Magdelene as the woman caught in adultery.


In the Catholic faith, there are three 'Authorities' on dogma; The word of the Pope, the traditions of the church, and the 'Word of Ghawd' (the Bible). Of the three, the Bible comez in at third place, behind the Pope and the traditionz. This is where many 'Fundamentalist' sects find a toehold, believing that the Bible itself iz the ultimate authority, (as interpreted by that sect's leaderz).

--T

carlsson
August 2nd, 2006, 03:39 PM
It is like reading the documentation to a software before disassembling the program to try and understand yourself exactly how it functions.

dpatten
August 2nd, 2006, 04:09 PM
Religion is an even worse topic than politics. That being said, let me assure you, I am familiar with Catholic rationalizations relating to their somewhat peculiar, (by my lights anyway) interpretation of scripture.

Terry Yager
August 2nd, 2006, 04:18 PM
Don't get me wrong...as Ellen DeGenerest has often said...I'm an Atheist, not a heathren!

--T

alexkerhead
August 2nd, 2006, 06:42 PM
Sometimes I think religion does more harm than good.
But please don't be offended.
I am agnostic.

CP/M User
August 2nd, 2006, 11:08 PM
dreddnott wrote:

> This is a rant thread, posted in the rants forum, so
> be understanding.

> Intoxication with alcohol lowers your inhibitions and
> brings out your true nature (or at least your
> subconscious impulses) - I think he meant what he
> said and I've KNOWN he's thought this way since the
> Passion was in production and various news agencies
> interviewed Mel and unearthed a much deeper
> ideological relationship with his father, Hutton
> Gibson, a rather infamous Holocaust denier and pre-
> Vatican II cultist, than had previously been visible
> to the general population.

I don't buy this story for one minute & I personally don't
care what the man said - the man was drunk.

Initally it was all this little story - which is all I think
it was, until some journal decided to put some words into
Mel's mouth. I mean if this story was so big, why wasn't the
initial story the case, I not that gullible to buy what's
happened - it's just their way of destroying people.


And no, I'm not part of any Mel Gibson fan club.

CP/M User.

dreddnott
August 3rd, 2006, 06:04 AM
Wait, what don't you buy? This definitely happened the way the police report says it did.

Otherwise, why would he apologise directly to the worldwide Jewish community? Just to make people *think* he said those things?

tgunner
August 3rd, 2006, 09:30 AM
Maybe they brain-washed him into thinking he said those things. How long ago did this happen?

dreddnott
August 3rd, 2006, 10:20 AM
It's been almost a week.

tgunner
August 3rd, 2006, 10:23 AM
Maybe he was saying this because of what Israel is doing to Lebanon?

CP/M User
August 3rd, 2006, 02:23 PM
dreddnott wrote:

> Wait, what don't you buy? This definitely happened
> the way the police report says it did.

The media story. First it was a simple story about how Police
saw someone speeding in their car - pulled them over - low &
behold it's Mel Gibson. Sure they take him down to the station
& his family bailed him out (US $5000 I think). That's the
story I'm sticking with. Any further dribble which came out
was done in a few minutes notice by some dude using a laptop.

> Otherwise, why would he apologise directly to the
> worldwide Jewish community? Just to make people
> *think* he said those things?

Anyone could apologise to the jewish community - even if it
was something they don't recall saying or doing. Or how about
it was part of some Media scandal that they would pay Mel to
Apologise - or someone's idea to have Mel apologising for
something which never happened. Either way it's mean't to make
the story look good.

CP/M User.

dreddnott
August 3rd, 2006, 07:55 PM
Your arguments are almost incomprehensible to me. There has been an extreme amount of consistent coverage on this incident over the past five days, including TIME Magazine and the LA and New York Times, which both confirmed the story as it initially ran on TMZ.com...

Do you really think there's a Jewish and/or liberal media conspiracy against Mel Gibson? He's a raging reactionary lunatic responsible for a film that purports to be the true gospel story but really pays homage to the pogrom-inspiring passion plays of the middle ages. Par for the course.

tgunner: that may be all well and good, and I have no problem with those who disagree with Israel politically, but Mel's slurs were directed towards the actual ethnic group more than a political entity or a religious ideology.

Terry Yager
August 3rd, 2006, 09:59 PM
I consider myself anti-Israeli (government), but I'm not anti Jewish. Hell, Jebus was a Jew, as were all twelve Apostlez...
Unfortunately, to speak out against Israeli policies often earns one the label of Anit-Semite (or anti-Jewish).

--T

CP/M User
August 4th, 2006, 01:31 AM
dreddnott wrote:

> Your arguments are almost incomprehensible to me.
> There has been an extreme amount of consistent
> coverage on this incident over the past five days,
> including TIME Magazine and the LA and New York
> Times, which both confirmed the story as it initially
> ran on TMZ.com...

That's right & the only reason it's been running for five days
is because the story has been developing over the last five
days. When they initally ran a story here in Aust it was like
I said above - no big deal - Mel's drunk. So my question is -
if they had all this other information, why wasn't it headline
news initally - the media (or someone) have simply added more
dribble to make it headline news.

> Do you really think there's a Jewish and/or liberal
> media conspiracy against Mel Gibson?

Any story is a media conspiracy! ;-) They always have an
agenda.

> He's a raging reactionary lunatic responsible for a
> film that purports to be the true gospel story but
> really pays homage to the pogrom-inspiring passion
> plays of the middle ages. Par for the course.

True, so that makes him the perfect target!

CP/M User.

carlsson
August 4th, 2006, 05:44 AM
I'm in line with Terry. Unfortunately, a bad regime can sometimes cast a shadow over a whole population or ethnic group, at least for the time being. This is not exclusive to Israel and the Jews.

Furthermore, I read that Mel Gibson picked up his current alcohol abuse while filming the upcoming Apocalypto somewhere in the jungle. Someone said Gibson almost went insane and was constantly in fight with the team. Maybe he was bitten by some strange fly which caused him to go lunatic and in combination with the alcohol and rage say things he didn't mean to say.

Terry Yager
August 4th, 2006, 07:15 AM
To address CP/M's point about the story expanding over time, there is a website which offers an explaination. Allegedly, there was an initial attempt to 'cover-up' the incident, by not reporting all the details. According to the article, there were actually two police reports made, one that included Mel's statements, and another sanitized version. The article can be found here:

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/28/gibsons-anti-semitic-tirade-alleged-cover-up/

--T

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:29 PM
"Personally, I got more displeasure watching The Simpson's when
they came to Australia - so I stopped watching it"

Umm, who started this thread lol. You abandon the show cuz it started poking fun at Aussies (presumably - I myself have probably seen all of one of "the Simpson's" in it's entirety).

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:32 PM
"Perhaps a Jewish person has the same feeling when watching a sitcom about life in a concentration camp?"

In reality, it wasn't a concentration camp. A bit of a difference. Maybe alot. It doesn't cast choimans in a good light, makes em look like idiots. The reality was some of them were very calculated cold blooded killers.
It's just a show though imho.
Funny this should come up though. I was watching a doc about the razis the other night. Some of what the Germans themselves had to go through on a daily basis reminded me of the ****ing crap the NJ idiot police put their citizens through on a daily basis. Ain't that funny...

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:39 PM
"Also, What's up w/ all the crap I've heard about The DaVinci Code!? It's fiction, not like they're trying to change the text in the bible or something!"

Well...hollywood is famous for ridiculing and outright attempting to dismantle various religious notions. You're so naive if you can't see it or are not aware of it. Regardless, what I personally find offensive is the liberal media trying put movies like the Duhvinci code in the same category as the Passion of the Christ. They'd LIKE to jump on the bandwagon of it's success, just that they find (in this present age) it nauseating to depict a religious theme in a positive way. Again, you're so naive if you can't see it.
Haven't seen either movie though. I might want to watch the Passion at some point to see how "accurate" it is. I don't know about the rest of you, but I felt it in my gut that Gibson was anti-semitic a long time ago, and now he can't hide it at all. Nothing against Catholics themselves, but when someone wants to go back to the pre-Vatican II glory days, it only seems like it's for a couple of reasons.

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:46 PM
"It is a brutal and violent movie that has a rating of Restricted... but every Christian film review webpage is saying you must see it!... And in the same breath they will tell you *not* to see other R rated movies because they are too violent!.. :( :( "

There's actually a very good point there. But keep in mind the bible itself is VERY violent. Some of it ain't actually good reading for chillins, at least the old testament, though I can't imagine keeping it away from little tykes. I don't know though. Maybe they shouldn't have access to some of it until they're old enough not to get too freaked out (like 30 maybe?).

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:53 PM
"I think the anti-semitic aspect of it is over-emphasized."

Like I said, didn't see the movie, but I had heard that Satan appears and is attired in the garb of something resembling a Jewish high priest, according to a vision or some crap of some 14th century nun. Significance?

"Gibson shows several members of the Sanhedrin leaving in disgust at the judicial end run that Jesus undergoes."

Dude, he couldn't tarnish all of them. After all, the apostles were all jewish lol.

"Also, Gibson clearly shows Gentile Roman soldiers as the ones who actually torture and execute Christ. I think he pretty clearly shows that Humanity, not just the Jews, are responsible for the death of Christ."

Wow this is one accurate movie after all! You mean he didn't depict the jews hanging him up there??!! He's my guy LOL LOL LOL. But your conclusion is wrong. God's love is culprit...albeit it's cuz of us filthy dogs he delivered him up ;). Alright alright, switching out of sermon mode. What business I got making one anyway I don't know :(

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 12:58 PM
Hopefully the last post of the day, but I'm not promising anything. Hey I got catching up to do.

"This is where many 'Fundamentalist' sects find a toehold, believing that the Bible itself iz the ultimate authority, (as interpreted by that sect's leaderz)."

If you're talking about Jim Jones and the Waco wacko, yes I'm in agreement. And to a far far lesser extent modern protestants and fundamentalists. But all "legitimate" (I knows it when I sees it) protestant "sects" adhere to the same basic tenets. So much so you have many Catholic "middle managers" using the same basic diaglogue. Yes you're only saved by faith...as long as you perform the sacraments. Yes Jesus is the only mediator between God and man...but you still gotta repent before the priest. So on and so forth.





It is like reading the documentation to a software before disassembling the program to try and understand yourself exactly how it functions.

Chris2005
August 8th, 2006, 01:08 PM
" When they initally ran a story here in Aust it was like I said above - no big deal - Mel's drunk."

Nope. Not an excuse for ethnic slurs and all the rest. Like was said, alcohol *can* show a person's true character. We don't need to hang the guy for what happened, but I don't like people using booze as an excuse to behave badly.

"So my question is if they had all this other information, why wasn't it headline
news initally - the media (or someone) have simply added dribble to make it headline news"

You just can't get away with making up all kinds of lies like that. He could have denied it. But he didn't.

"Do you really think there's a Jewish and/or liberal media conspiracy against Mel Gibson?"

I wouldn't deny it if it seemed likely. I don't trust the media. But I think the facts are clear.

"He's a raging reactionary lunatic responsible for a film that purports to be the true gospel story but really pays homage to the pogrom-inspiring passion plays of the middle ages. Par for the course."

"True, so that makes him the perfect target?"

Well...umm, it just might make the story accurate...

Erik
August 8th, 2006, 01:29 PM
Quick note:

The http://www.vintage-computer.com/vcforum/images/buttons/multiquote_off.gif icon is a new feature as of last night. With it you can tag multiple posts to quote in a single reply.

That is all.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled rant.