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Thread: running 5x86 cpu in IBM 5150 with Inboard/386

  1. #11
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    hello
    today i started out , thinking about writing , going back from Cyrix5x86 to IBM486BL due to the slow speed of the Cyrix.
    And i did test the Cyrix (no cache) then the 486BL with cache and both at 50Mhz speed. The later did very well the first not so good.

    And here a great thanks to stynx , for sharing the transcomputer driver tool , that enables the cache - it works and the result is a PC running at mind blowing high speed !

    (most admit , did test the encache.exe for the first time today - had planed to test it earlier , but first go around to try it out today )
    Today i did test the Cyrix5x86(no cache) then IBM 486 BL and last the Cyrix 5x86 with cache on.
    I did use the speed test from
    http://www.philscomputerlab.com/dos-benchmark-pack.html

    ...it states:
    "
    At the end of the benchmark you will see a value for realticks. To workout the FPS you need to use this formula:

    FPS = 74690 / realticks.
    "
    and the speed with 486BL in DOOM is notisable faster the Cyrix with no cache.

    2017_05_13_9999_3.jpg 2017_05_13_9999_5.jpg

    My DOOM test results:

    ibm 486bl 50Mhz
    small window 74690/3265 = 22,8 fps
    maximum window 74690/11757 = 6,3 fps


    cyrix5x86 at 50Mhz no cache

    small windows 74690/11591 = 6,44 fps
    maximum windows 74690/49193 = 1,52 fps

    cyrix5x86 at 50Mhz with cache on

    small window 74690/2757 = 27,01 fps
    maximum windows 74690/10229 = 7,30 fps

    ( the demo runnning at 7,3 FPS looks very impressive )

    I also did a Winstone94 test :

    IBM 486BL at 50 Mhz : score 12,1


    5x86 with cache on : Score,"13,33778"
    2017_05_13_9999_17.jpg


    other testresults:

    2017_05_13_9999_8.jpg 2017_05_13_9999_18.jpg

    and topbstub data , with cache on:

    ;Data collected by: TOPBENCH | Benchmark and detection stub | Version 0.97
    ;This file contains fingerprinting information about your computer. Please
    ;email this file to trixter@oldskool.org with a subject line of "Benchmark" to
    ;help test these routines and seed the TOPBENCH database.

    [UID745019165]
    MemoryTest=157
    OpcodeTest=154
    VidramTest=1180
    MemEATest=163
    3DGameTest=92
    Score=36
    CPU=Cyrix 5x86-S (clock x3 mode)
    CPUspeed=80 MHz
    BIOSinfo=unknown
    MachineModel=0000
    BIOSdate=20120502
    BIOSCRC16=7450
    VideoSystem=VGA
    VideoAdapter=VGA, unknown Chipset, 256kb Video Memory (BIOS)
    Machine=PC


    Only thing about the encache.exe is , -i think- it makes the CPU unaware of what DMA does to ram. After enable cache the floppy "dir" did look like this

    2017_05_13_9999_20.jpg

    ... have only to say, the 486BL is nice and fast, but the Cyrix586 at 50Mhz and the cache enabled, is just mind blowingly fast! And the Cyrix will not be replaced in near future

    2017_05_13_9999_15.jpg

    * a hardware note - my Inboard386 board were running at normal 16Mhz and not overclocked.

    /cimonvg

  2. #12
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    I am simply unable to believe that works.
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  3. #13

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    Now I definitely need something like this on my model 25. I don't care if I fabricate my own ISA riser with 3 slots (one inverted on the reverse side), I will make this happen now. Holy crap this is awesome.
    IBM PS/2 Model 25, NEC V30 8MHz, 640KB RAM, ATI VGA Wonder XL, 2GB SSD, Ethernet, DR DOS 6/GeOS, Xircom PE3 Ethernet

  4. #14

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    I think you tried Pentium overdrive before, correct? What was the story with that chip?
    "Will the Highways on the internets become more few?"

    V'Ger XT

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymous Coward View Post
    I think you tried Pentium overdrive before, correct? What was the story with that chip?
    hello
    I know the Pentium overdrive exists , but i do not have one... But did Cyrix586 not do better the the overdrive , back in the days ?
    The cyrix i have now, only supports *3 clockspeed, if i could get a cyrix 120Mhz/100Mhz with *4 , i would properly do better score (?)
    ...and i have to look into the heat exhaust , the cpu did not get that warm , but other chips did warm up...
    /cimonvg

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimonvg View Post
    @ Chuck(G), yes if the CPU depends on the BUS speed, then i am at the limit, but if some setting can open for more cpu speed ?

    @ evildragon , have to try that one out some day

    /cimonvg
    Way back in the day, I have a Zenith Z-200 PC, and in it, of course you had their proprietary but compatible backplane, but I had two video cards, a Zenith CGA card connected to via ribbon a Z-100 mode card even though the Z-100 mode card had its own external connectors.

    I've thought about way back all of these processor upgrade cards, and of course, you can't make the 8-bit operate more than it was designed to do, reliably, but what if you somehow moved data off of the bus entirely in between compatible upgraded cards via ribbon or some other type of connector, kind of like how video cards are connected together via SLI, leaving the 8-bit bus to simply do initialization and base power?
    Daniel P. Cayea - The Lyon Mountain Company - Plattsburgh, New York 12901
    Vintage Equipment: IBM 5150 * IBM 5161 * ThinkPad 770ED
    Modern Equipment: MacBook Pro 13 * Alienware M15R3

  7. #17
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    hello
    sorry a bit late reply

    @lyonadmiral,
    I also like the idear of thinking out of the box, and persue the "impossible" sometimes to overcome the obstacles and make something that works

    @evildragon , sorry to remind you, the Inboard386 only supports 8088 and not 8086
    - the SOTA386 supports 8086 , but no RAM extention there...

    @next, today i did some test with the same hardware setup, but with DOS and himem.sys (no cdrom drivers , and no NetRoom3).
    all of a sudden i rembered that the protected mode operation (Netroom) perhaps did influens the performance (and the accuracy of the speed measurements)

    Boot into DOS then 5x86 register settings, and the enable of the cache (with encache.exe), but the score in DOOM is almost the exact same .

    with HIMEM.SYS:

    small window 74690 / 2716 = 27,5

    big window 74690 / 10091 = 7,4016

    and speed and checkit also look like the NetRoom3 scores:


    miniDSCN5051.jpg miniDSCN5053.jpg


    TOPBENCH dos+himem.sys

    [UID7450187E]
    MemoryTest=156
    OpcodeTest=119
    VidramTest=1182
    MemEATest=164
    3DGameTest=93
    Score=37
    CPU=Cyrix 5x86-S (clock x3 mode)
    CPUspeed=80 MHz
    BIOSinfo=unknown
    MachineModel=0000
    BIOSdate=20120502
    BIOSCRC16=7450
    VideoSystem=VGA
    VideoAdapter=VGA, unknown Chipset, 256kb Video Memory (BIOS)
    Machine=PC


    two notes about this setup.
    1. i get a annoying error at warmboot. The PC starts to load dos then Inboard driver , but it do not stop at 4 Mb but carries on to 16Mb
    - then i have to cut the power and start again. Hardware reset seems to go better
    2. the read/write data to the floppy is unusable in DOS with the cache enabled with ENCACHE.EXE . BUT in windws 3.11 (with the cache enabled) i can read and write floppies

    /cimonvg

  8. #18
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    Default ISA bandwith limit

    hello
    here som follow up on the ISA bandwith limit.
    Few weeks ago is was searching for Cyrix 5x86 capable of doing x4 , in my case 16Mhz x 4= 64 Mhz. I
    did spot one on auction - but did not win it.
    Thinking, thinking - perhaps my 5x86 120GP had the x4 option. I did some tests with evergreen
    ET586.exe tool, and did read that cyrix586 does not enter x4 if booted in x3 mode. I then changed the
    setting on my VRM from x3 to x2. Did some more test and did measured the speed. The x4 never appeared
    on the data - but i noticed that x2 with Cyrix produced quite high results. And the story about the
    goat and the oil in mind - i then did some more testing.
    Started out with a few tests, but extended to cover : Winstone94, Doom_v1.9 demo, pimasm, intel
    floatdos, lanmark, puzzle and windows Helix discover (memory test). In fact several pages of data.
    I took some time to look at the data - and I chose to draw graph where x-axis cpu speed with data from
    lanmark and y-axis with Doom demo (b) (big window) FPS.
    And the result:

    vcfed-cpu-fts1_.jpg



    graph made of the following data:
    cpu Driver: lanmark Mhz Doom demo(b) Doom -fps
    386+387 19,77 41583 1,796
    cyrix5x86x2 no cache 22,9 50027 1,49
    Cyrix486 pga168 Driver: CACHEON.SYS 76,8 14653 5,09
    ibm,486BL x2 Driver: revto486.sys 94,5 12989 5,75
    cyrix5x86 x2 Driver: CACHEON.SYS 150 10690 6,99
    cyrix5x86x3 Driver: CACHEON.SYS 200 10271 7,27
    amd5x86 x3 Driver: CACHEON.SYS 223 10174 7,34
    cyrix5x86x2 Driver:CACHEON.SYS and 5x86 register config 238 10522 7,09
    amd5x86 x4 Driver: CACHEON.SYS 264 9932 7,52
    cyrix5x86x3 Driver:CACHEON.SYS and 5x86 register config 299 10088 7,4


    I read the data in this way - if i upgrade the IBM pc to more than (CPU Lanmark spec.) 200 Mhz - there is practically no additional benefit. Only more oil on the goat

    NB ... all tests are made with same hardware / software, only difference is the CPU and cache driver tool
    NB i would still like to try the cyrix586 x4 cpu - applications that do not use the ISA bus would still run faster
    /cimonvg
    Last edited by Cimonvg; May 6th, 2018 at 07:54 AM.

  9. #19
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    Oil on the goat indeed! Thanks for the updated data.
    Offering a bounty for:
    - A working Sanyo MBC-775 or Logabax 1600
    - Music Construction Set, IBM Music Feature edition (has red sticker on front stating IBM Music Feature)

  10. #20

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    I do think a p24t “should” help due to better cache and floating point which are what you need on a bus constrained system

    The trouble will be that the legendary Pentium overdrive was notoriously incompatible.

    But when it did work with cache enabled it did things other 486 chips (including 5x86’s) couldn’t do

    I have one in my basement

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