Image Map Image Map
Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456
Results 51 to 60 of 60

Thread: Wire wrap

  1. #51
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    in the basement
    Posts
    878

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    The easiest way for me to explain the daisy-chain problem is to show virtual examples using my wirewrap documentation application. .......
    Very elaborate work you have done Rob .....magnificent!
    Still.........I don't get it . I don't see the purpose of A3j-22 .

    Knowing your busy schedule, whenever you had a chance.....please
    show a couple of photos or a short video of you method. I am sure
    many people would find it useful.

    Brilliant work...

    ziloo

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Kent, England
    Posts
    128

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ziloo View Post
    Very elaborate work you have done Rob .....magnificent!
    Still.........I don't get it . I don't see the purpose of A3j-22 .

    Knowing your busy schedule, whenever you had a chance.....please
    show a couple of photos or a short video of you method. I am sure
    many people would find it useful.

    Brilliant work...

    ziloo
    I included A3J-22 in this example just to illustrate what happens when one needs to make a change later. My project is really a very elaborate prototype which I develop and test in stages, so there is a good chance that my original wiring won't be the final result. Currently I am trying to decide where on the backplane to place the logic modules for my control memory, so if I change my mind later a lot of wires will have to be reconnected to different locations. There are a lot of factors, such as cross-talk between wires, capacitative loading, heating in the logic modules and so on that may not become evident as problems until later, apart from the simple problem of not having anywhere convenient to position the next set of modules, so I have to accept that I am likely to have to rip out a lot of wires and refit them. In a project like mine the importance of wire-wrapped connections is that they can be changed relatively easily, so thinking about that from the outset is sensible.
    Rob - http://www.honeypi.org.uk
    The Internet is a winch to get your project off the ground ... but always have a parachute handy.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    in the basement
    Posts
    878

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    ...I included A3J-22 in this example just to illustrate what happens when one needs to make a change later...
    Alright Rob....I read through the previous post again and now I got it.
    I didn't quite understand your notation for a wire such as A3j -22,
    because I was reading it as wires A3j through A22 ??????

    Very nice work! I haven't done any wire wrapping myself previously;
    I usually ask my butler to pickup the board and do the wiring. And
    with his busy schedule in the palace, he calls his butler to do the wiring,
    and ..... you guessed it .... the daisy-chain continues as he calls his butler to
    fool around with the wiring....
    .......................... Wire wrapping is such a headache...

    ziloo

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Chilliwack, BC, Canada
    Posts
    147

    Default

    Is that application specific to the Honeywell you're working on, or can it be configured for other circuits?
    My vintage systems: Tandy 1000 HX, Tandy 1000 RSX, and some random Pentium in a Hewitt Rand chassis...

    Some people keep a classic car in their garage. Some people keep vintage computers. The latter hobby is cheaper, usually takes less space, and is less likely to lead to a fatal accident.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Kent, England
    Posts
    128

    Default

    Damn! While I was typing my response the site logged me out and then hung when I logged back in, so I lost all my text permanently with no autosave. I'm just not used to using such a hostile implementation of vBulletin as this site seems to be. It's happened to me several times now but I'm used to using the vBulletin built-in editor to type posts, not having to paste posts in from friendlier software to avoid the timeout problem. Does anyone here know anything about computer systems?

    I discovered that the system has a fifteen minute limit on subsequent edits like this one as well, which must result in uncorrectable inaccuracies in posts, but I'm an infrequent subscriber and don't regard the site as my home turf, so just grumble.

    And now it's time for me to stop typing and get out of bed anyway. Bye.
    Last edited by RobS; March 17th, 2019 at 12:51 AM.
    Rob - http://www.honeypi.org.uk
    The Internet is a winch to get your project off the ground ... but always have a parachute handy.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Cleveland, OH, USA
    Posts
    877

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    Damn! While I was typing my response the site logged me out ...

    I discovered that the system has a fifteen minute limit on subsequent edits like this one as well, which must result in uncorrectable inaccuracies in posts, but I'm an infrequent subscriber and don't regard the site as my home turf, so just grumble.
    Happens to us all from time to time. Being somewhat long-winded myself, I have made a habit of highlighting all text and keying CTL-C before posting my reply. When I find myself locked out I can go back to the thread, open a new reply and CTL-V. Supposedly there is an auto-save but it's never complete.

    On the subject of wire-wrapping, however, this has been a fascinating discussion. Thank you for your contribution to the topic.

    -CH-

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Kent, England
    Posts
    128

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by clh333 View Post
    Happens to us all from time to time. Being somewhat long-winded myself, I have made a habit of highlighting all text and keying CTL-C before posting my reply. When I find myself locked out I can go back to the thread, open a new reply and CTL-V. Supposedly there is an auto-save but it's never complete.

    On the subject of wire-wrapping, however, this has been a fascinating discussion. Thank you for your contribution to the topic.

    -CH-
    Thanks for that. In the creative writing forum to which I regularly subscribe I have awards for over a thousand LOLs and over a thousand Likes and if they had an award for being long-winded a thousand times I'd have that as well. Consider yourselves fortunate that I don't come here very often.
    Rob - http://www.honeypi.org.uk
    The Internet is a winch to get your project off the ground ... but always have a parachute handy.

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Kent, England
    Posts
    128

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ziloo View Post
    Alright Rob....I read through the previous post again and now I got it.
    I didn't quite understand your notation for a wire such as A3j -22,
    because I was reading it as wires A3j through A22 ??????

    ziloo
    Ah yes, I see. I use the original Honeywell 200 pin identifiers, so A3J-22 is zone A column 3 row J block 2 pin 2. It’s actually a very easy way to find a specific pin on the backplane.

    Quote Originally Posted by blackepyon View Post
    Is that application specific to the Honeywell you're working on, or can it be configured for other circuits?
    All the wiring data is stored in a standard relational database and as designing those was something that I used to do in my day job it’s pretty generic and normalised. I actually use the MariaDB database engine on my antique workroom laptop that still runs Windows XP, but the database schema can be exported as standard SQL, so is portable.

    I wrote the application using an old copy of Borland Delphi that I acquired somewhere a long time ago, in a packet of cornflakes maybe, and some parts of it, such as the calculation of the wire lengths obviously, are specific to the Honeywell backplane, so would need to be altered. I am obviously used to making useful things out of old junk and that approach to life is evident in the software that I use as well, so it might not be easy for anyone else to modify my code.

    Also I only included the essential functions for doing the wiring in the application and the less frequent tasks, like defining the functions of the pins on a new type of logic module and recording where the modules are positioned on the backplane, I do by directly editing the database tables with a suitable editor. I use the HeidiSQL editor for this, but any would do. Again I’m used to telling an editor what I want done using SQL to get things done quickly, but it isn’t everyone’s cup of tea.

    I think it’s a shame that relational databases are regarded as tools for software developers to use behind the scenes rather than something for use by end users. For example, the Microsoft Office suite of applications used to optionally include the Access database application (I don’t use Microsoft applications so have no idea whether that’s still true.) but I suspect that most users don’t go beyond using a spreadsheet for organising their data logically. Even with Access there was a graphical query system that avoided the need to write SQL.

    As an example of the things that can be done with my database, every logic module pin has a defined standard type, such as a current source or sink, logical output or input, wired-or output or input, power bus and so on. Hence I can write a query asking whether any normal logic signal net has more than one output in it or whether two current sources are connected together, i.e. any situation that could result in damage to components. Therefore the wiring application is only one part of my system, so not that useful on its own.

    So the quick answer to your question is “Only with difficulty,” but I seldom give quick answers.
    Last edited by RobS; March 18th, 2019 at 12:53 AM.
    Rob - http://www.honeypi.org.uk
    The Internet is a winch to get your project off the ground ... but always have a parachute handy.

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Chilliwack, BC, Canada
    Posts
    147

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    Ah yes, I see. I use the original Honeywell 200 pin identifiers, so A3J-22 is zone A column 3 row J block 2 pin 2. It’s actually a very easy way to find a specific pin on the backplane.



    All the wiring data is stored in a standard relational database and as designing those was something that I used to do in my day job it’s pretty generic and normalised. I actually use the MariaDB database engine on my antique workroom laptop that still runs Windows XP, but the database schema can be exported as standard SQL, so is portable.

    I wrote the application using an old copy of Borland Delphi that I acquired somewhere a long time ago, in a packet of cornflakes maybe, and some parts of it, such as the calculation of the wire lengths obviously, are specific to the Honeywell backplane, so would need to be altered. I am obviously used to making useful things out of old junk and that approach to life is evident in the software that I use as well, so it might not be easy for anyone else to modify my code.

    Also I only included the essential functions for doing the wiring in the application and the less frequent tasks, like defining the functions of the pins on a new type of logic module and recording where the modules are positioned on the backplane, I do by directly editing the database tables with a suitable editor. I use the HeidiSQL editor for this, but any would do. Again I’m used to telling an editor what I want done using SQL to get things done quickly, but it isn’t everyone’s cup of tea.

    I think it’s a shame that relational databases are regarded as tools for software developers to use behind the scenes rather than something for use by end users. For example, the Microsoft Office suite of applications used to optionally include the Access database application (I don’t use Microsoft applications so have no idea whether that’s still true.) but I suspect that most users don’t go beyond using a spreadsheet for organising their data logically. Even with Access there was a graphical query system that avoided the need to write SQL.

    As an example of the things that can be done with my database, every logic module pin has a defined standard type, such as a current source or sink, logical output or input, wired-or output or input, power bus and so on. Hence I can write a query asking whether any normal logic signal net has more than one output in it or whether two current sources are connected together, i.e. any situation that could result in damage to components. Therefore the wiring application is only one part of my system, so not that useful on its own.

    So the quick answer to your question is “Only with difficulty,” but I seldom give quick answers.
    Wish I had time to learn to program. I've done VisualBasic scripting, but that's all I've had time to get into. Too many other things to do.
    My vintage systems: Tandy 1000 HX, Tandy 1000 RSX, and some random Pentium in a Hewitt Rand chassis...

    Some people keep a classic car in their garage. Some people keep vintage computers. The latter hobby is cheaper, usually takes less space, and is less likely to lead to a fatal accident.

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Cleveland, OH, USA
    Posts
    877

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    ...Iím used to telling an editor what I want done using SQL to get things done quickly, but it isnít everyoneís cup of tea...
    Trained and certified in Oracle SQL, spent years as a database application developer for the Engineering Dept. of a municipal utility.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    ... the Microsoft Office suite of applications used to optionally include the Access database application ...
    Still does, with the Office Professional edition.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    ... Even with Access there was a graphical query system that avoided the need to write SQL.
    The beauty of Access was the access it gave to VBA. It was like Borland on steroids. Access' database engine is all SQL under the hood: You couldn't create a union query graphically, for example.

    Quote Originally Posted by RobS View Post
    ...I seldom give quick answers.
    You and me both, brother.

    -CH-

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •