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Thread: Apple 1 PROM programming (MMI 6301)

  1. #1

    Default Apple 1 PROM programming (MMI 6301)

    I am looking to program a few MMI 6301-1J for my Apple 1 clone. Alternately an Data I/O 29 with Unipak to program them myself.

  2. #2
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    Sorry for the late reply, but I just recently joined the forum.

    I don't know if you are still looking for this,
    but I can provide these proms if you still need them.

    PM me.
    Thanks,
    Stephan

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steph View Post
    Sorry for the late reply, but I just recently joined the forum.

    I don't know if you are still looking for this,
    but I can provide these proms if you still need them.

    PM me.
    Thanks,
    Stephan
    Are you able to program other manufacturers like the Intel 3621? I have lots if you can. Also I have one to get programmed for the SYM-1 FDC and I have one with the MMI 6301 programmed so I can provide the code or the chip to copy. I am in Minnesota.
    Dave

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by orgwood View Post
    Are you able to program other manufacturers like the Intel 3621?

    I can program just about any type of bipolar proms,
    but for some reason, none of my programmers appear to have the Intel proms listed.
    (...not even my trusty Data I/O 29B programmer, which can do ANYTHING ! )

    Was this line of proms known under a different name ?
    (... like AMD which became MMI ? )

    That said, many of these old proms are programmed the same way,
    so I'm reasonably confident that I can "likely" program your Intel 3621 using a compatible chip (like the MMI 6301).

    [ I replied to your PM with more details...]

    Cheers,
    Stephan

  5. #5
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    I have a BK Precision 867C that will program most bipolar proms. The MMI 6301 isn't listed, but most equivalent types (82S129, 27S21, 74S287 and 24S10) are supported. If you don't care about the brand I have MH74S287's here.

    I don't have any programming data on the Intel 6321's specifically, but it's listed as a 256x4 equivalent of the above types so likely will program in the 867C. Happy to try (I'm in the USA so shipping might be a bit less costly.

    - Gary

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by orgwood View Post
    Are you able to program other manufacturers like the Intel 3621?
    Probably not on the DataI/O without knowing the family and pin code for the Intel device. I also could not find that Intel part on my Data I/O wall chart. From the spec sheet, it says it burns the fuses at 15V while the MMI 6301 fuses at 30V. Using the codes for the MMI part might blow the Intel part.

    Here's a link to a partial specification for the Intel 3601/3621 PROM : https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9r...iODViZDdj/view

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by gekaufman View Post
    I have a BK Precision 867C that will program most bipolar proms. The MMI 6301 isn't listed, but most equivalent types (82S129, 27S21, 74S287 and 24S10) are supported.

    Just a word of caution about prom programming compatibility.

    I had to do some digging around to realize that there are two "generations" of bipolar proms...

    Older (1st generation ) Proms (circa 1975 -1978 ) have fuses made of NiCr (Nickel-Chrome/NiChrome).
    These need a programmer capable of producing a fairly high current to provide enough amperage to blow the fuses.

    Common proms from this generation are :
    MMI 6301, 6331, etc
    Intersil 5306, 5310, 5323

    Most programmers can NOT do these.
    Of the many programmers I have, only the early Data I/O programmers (29B, Series-22, etc..) can do these.
    [ ... if you've ever seen a Data I/O 29B programmer, you'll see that it's just one big 15 lbs power supply... ]


    Later proms (circa 1979-1985) have fuses made of TiW (Titanium/Tungsten).
    [ Edit : ...or other allows which have a lower "burning" threshold ]

    These don't require as much "juice" , and are supported by most prom-capable programmers.
    All the proms you mention above, and thankfully most of the proms out there, fall into this category.

    So if your programmer does not have the specific prom you want to program,
    chances are it won't support it.

    --

    The Intel proms mentioned by OrgWood are somewhat of a mystery,
    as none of my programmers seem to support them.

    I can offer to try programming one as "older" style and/or as a "newer" generation prom,
    but I have no idea if that will work.

    My other question is whether these Intel proms are known under a different name.
    I ask because MMI was created as an off-shoot of AMD, so the early 6301 proms can be found
    on some programmer under AMD, and on others as MMI.

    Clear as mud ....?

    Steph
    Last edited by Steph; April 27th, 2020 at 04:04 PM.

  8. #8
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    Thanks, that's very helpful.

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    Found this that appears to give equivalents to the 3621, but I suppose it may not be programmng equivalent

    Signetics MMI TI Harris Raytheon AMD National Intel
    TS 82S129 (50ns) 6301-1 24S10 7611-5 29661 27S21 74S287 3621


    https://www.mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/...ge=PromRef.txt
    Last edited by Gary C; April 28th, 2020 at 12:07 AM.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steph View Post
    Just a word of caution about prom programming compatibility.

    I had to do some digging around to realize that there are two "generations" of bipolar proms...

    Older (1st generation ) Proms (circa 1975 -1978 ) have fuses made of NiCr (Nickel-Chrome/NiChrome).
    These need a programmer capable of producing a fairly high current to provide enough amperage to blow the fuses.

    Common proms from this generation are :
    MMI 6301, 6331, etc
    Intersil 5306, 5310, 5323

    Most programmers can NOT do these.
    Of the many programmers I have, only the early Data I/O programmers (29B, Series-22, etc..) can do these.
    [ ... if you've ever seen a Data I/O 29B programmer, you'll see that it's just one big 15 lbs power supply... ]


    Later proms (circa 1979-1985) have fuses made of TiW (Titanium/Tungsten).
    [ Edit : ...or other allows which have a lower "burning" threshold ]

    These don't require as much "juice" , and are supported by most prom-capable programmers.
    All the proms you mention above, and thankfully most of the proms out there, fall into this category.

    So if your programmer does not have the specific prom you want to program,
    chances are it won't support it.

    --

    The Intel proms mentioned by OrgWood are somewhat of a mystery,
    as none of my programmers seem to support them.

    I can offer to try programming one as "older" style and/or as a "newer" generation prom,
    but I have no idea if that will work.


    My other question is whether these Intel proms are known under a different name.
    I ask because MMI was created as an off-shoot of AMD, so the early 6301 proms can be found
    on some programmer under AMD, and on others as MMI.

    Clear as mud ....?

    Steph
    Just a clarification here about MMI and AMD. I worked for Signetics in 1972-3, MMI in 1974-76. AMD bought MMI later. I also worked for Intel around 1979 and my Intel PROMs came to me via a return by my customer 3M that Intel didn't want back in-house. So I have PROMs from early MMI and early Intel both in the early to mid 1970s. I have the scanned and posted the manual with schematic for the MMI 535 Programmer but have yet to build it. I just turned 73 yrs old.
    Dave Colglazier

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