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Ibm 5110 dos

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    Ibm 5110 dos

    Hey,
    I was wondering if running dos on a Basic/Apl machine, specifically the 5110, was even possible. I don't know if there is some form of DOS that doesn't require the 80x86 architecture, or a single CPU for that matter. Maybe a DOS emulation running in BASIC? I don't know,
    Thanks,
    Harper

    #2
    Lots of DOSes ran on other architectures, most having no relationship to MS-DOS. The 5100 PALM was built using an emulated System 360 so conceivably one could have moved DOS/360 to it. The 5100 had about the same memory as the lower end of the 360 range that ran DOS/360. Might have been a bit overkill for the actual use of a 5100 though.

    Comment


      #3
      If you mean MS-DOS/clones thereof specifically, well, no, that's x86-specific. Hypothetically one could develop an emulator for it to run on the 5100 series, but there isn't much compelling reason other than just to say you did.
      Computers: Amiga 1200, DEC VAXStation 4000/60, DEC MicroPDP-11/73
      Synthesizers: Roland JX-10/SH-09/MT-32/D-50, Yamaha DX7-II/V50/TX7/TG33/FB-01, Korg MS-20 Mini/ARP Odyssey/DW-8000/X5DR, Ensoniq SQ-80, E-mu Proteus/2, Moog Satellite, Oberheim SEM
      "'Legacy code' often differs from its suggested alternative by actually working and scaling." - Bjarne Stroustrup

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        #4
        Originally posted by krebizfan View Post
        Lots of DOSes ran on other architectures, most having no relationship to MS-DOS. The 5100 PALM was built using an emulated System 360 so conceivably one could have moved DOS/360 to it. The 5100 had about the same memory as the lower end of the 360 range that ran DOS/360. Might have been a bit overkill for the actual use of a 5100 though.
        I don't believe that the PALM implemented supervisor mode--and I'll bet that the PSW differed considerably. Then there's the matter of the channels. Still a 5100 with a few 2402s, 2311s and a 2501 might be interesting...
        Reach me: vcfblackhole _at_ protonmail dot com.

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          #5
          Excuse my ignorance, but are those some sort of IC's to hook into the PALM?

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            #6
            No, they're IBM tape, disk and card units for the S/360. The channels would be a real challenge...
            Reach me: vcfblackhole _at_ protonmail dot com.

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              #7
              Could you run DOS/VS on a 5110? If so, does anybody have a copy of the files ��?? (I guess I could transfer them to a machine with a modified 8" drive from a 3.5" from a semi-modern computer)

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                #8
                Well I don't know about the 5100, but I do know the 5110 has disk drives and a cassete drive. If you could find a version on 8" floppy of DOS/360 or DOS/VS, maybe you could transfer it either to the 5110, or copy it to cassete and move it to the 5100?

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                  #9
                  Once again, excuse my ignorance, I was born after Y2K (), but what is superviser mode? (My exposure to a functioning System/360 is limited)

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                    #10
                    Crikey--first of all, the PALM doesn't implement the S/360 instruction set. It has emulator code that allows it to interpretively execute the code stored in the APL or BASIC memories, which are accessed as peripherals, not as main memory. The interpreter interprets either a subset of S/360 or S/3 code, depending on the language being used.

                    The microcode for the 5110 is documented here.

                    Can you run DOS/VS on an 8008 system with a disk? Probably--the 8008 is Turing-complete. You can also run DOS/VS with a few large bowls and truckloads of pennies. I wouldn't want to do either--life is way too short.
                    Reach me: vcfblackhole _at_ protonmail dot com.

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                      #11
                      Would a tape emulator be possible for the 5110? I can use the smartphone to record(SAVE) and load stuff back on the 5110, but that's regular "audio" signals. Just to begin, where would one get cable connector ends for that set of 3 ports on the back of the 5110? But the "external" tape seems to be different than the 5110 model 1 internal tape (or 5100 tape), which connects to the "tape" port on the "A1 board" itself (and has different data rates and capacity).

                      Even if a 5106 tape deck can be found, can any suitable tapes be found? Hence a tape emulator mechanism would be handy.
                      IBM 5110 ['78], PET 4016 ['80], C64 ['82], IBM PC 5150B ['84]. A retired SysOp, creator of destinyhunter.org, VUC, ANT

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                        #12
                        Check out http://computermuseum.informatik.uni...k/en/5110.html

                        The tape used was the DC300 QIC tape. DC600 QIC could also be used if what I read is correct. Those are still available but relatively pricey for old tape.

                        Are you sure about the different data rates between internal and external tape drives? I thought the external drive was equivalent to the internal drive but very nicely shielded. It is not an audio interface so a MP3 player or smartphone will not work.

                        I remember reading about an early QIC tape emulator out there but I can't track down it down. Someone else I hope remembers it. Not set up for the 5100 series but might be close enough to modify into working.

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                          #13
                          Al, using IBM's squib, they sure look like it though--what were they? I know the prototype used regular audio-cassette sized tapes.

                          Reach me: vcfblackhole _at_ protonmail dot com.

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                            #14
                            They're DC300 carts all right. But the data format is not any QIC standard. For a start it's two (parallel) track. Not serpentine.

                            I would also be surprised to learn the external drive has a different data rate. Unless it also has a different tape speed, and the end result is a recorded cartridge that can be read on either drive.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Chuck(G) View Post
                              Crikey--first of all, the PALM doesn't implement the S/360 instruction set. It has emulator code that allows it to interpretively execute the code stored in the APL or BASIC memories, which are accessed as peripherals, not as main memory. The interpreter interprets either a subset of S/360 or S/3 code, depending on the language being used.
                              Clearly what needs to be done here is someone needs to cook up some new PALM microcode so it emulates an 8086 CPU. Then, sure, it'll run DOS, right?
                              My Retro-computing YouTube Channel (updates... eventually?): Paleozoic PCs Also: Blogspot

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