MikeModifed
Veteran Member
There's a longish backstory with pics that will have to wait until after the holiday. Everyone have a SAFE and happy holiday!
Mike
- VCF South West - June 14 - 16, Davidson-Gundy Alumni Center at University of Texas at Dallas
- VCF West - Aug 2 - 3, Computer History Museum, Mountain View, CA
- VCF Midwest - Sept 7 - 8 2024, Schaumburg, IL
- VCF SoCal - Mid February 2025, Location TBD, Southern CA
- VCF East - April 2025, Infoage Museum, Wall NJ
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A 16 has been added to the collection
- Thread starter MikeModifed
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There's a longish backstory with pics that will have to wait until after the holiday. Everyone have a SAFE and happy holiday!
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
I got the system for a very reasonable price.
The drives are dirty, of course. The seller tried a disk:
Unfortunately, he used the master "Model 16 Systems Diskette" (TRSDOS-II 4.1/TRSDOS-16).
Mike
The drives are dirty, of course. The seller tried a disk:
Unfortunately, he used the master "Model 16 Systems Diskette" (TRSDOS-II 4.1/TRSDOS-16).
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
UPS pulled up in front of my house and I went out to meet him.
As he gets out he says, "I've got a big one for you."
"Yep, 95 lbs."
"Car parts?" he asks.
"No. A vintage computer."
"What was he thinking?" he asks, shaking his head, and gets the 95# box out of the back of the truck.
Opening it up, NOTHING removed:
Removing the small amount of newspaper and the box containing the keyboard, floppies, and one manual:
Close-up of first apparent damage:
Take it into the house, pull the cover, and the CRT is hanging by one screw!
The two left side screw sets are in the lower left corner of the case. With the CRT tightly screwed down, the 16 fires right up with no more damage than the case, although the keyboard may have suffered some damage as it was poorly packed as well.
Mike
As he gets out he says, "I've got a big one for you."
"Yep, 95 lbs."
"Car parts?" he asks.
"No. A vintage computer."
"What was he thinking?" he asks, shaking his head, and gets the 95# box out of the back of the truck.
Opening it up, NOTHING removed:
Removing the small amount of newspaper and the box containing the keyboard, floppies, and one manual:
Close-up of first apparent damage:
Take it into the house, pull the cover, and the CRT is hanging by one screw!
The two left side screw sets are in the lower left corner of the case. With the CRT tightly screwed down, the 16 fires right up with no more damage than the case, although the keyboard may have suffered some damage as it was poorly packed as well.
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
So I send pictures of the damage to him and he responds:
Sorry it was damaged however you're incorrect in blaming me for it. The box isn't a storage box, it's a double walled cardboard box that's rated by the USPS for shipping. The contents were packed fairly tightly with newspaper and cardboard. There was no failing on my part when it came to packing of the contents. Just from looking at the box you can see it was kicked, dropped, and smashed dozens of times on it's way to you by UPS. Sure if I spent $300 and put it in a wooden crate with custom foam inserts and feathers it may have had a better outcome, but we have to be realistic here. I paid them $130 and more than clearly marked the contents as fragile. I expect better handling. Think about the amount of force you'd need to crack that casing. That could only happen if they dropped it off a truck or crushed it with another package.
Don't know why you're saying I'm lucky, the computer was poorly handled and damaged by people I trusted to do their job and get it to you in the condition I sent it.
It was insured for $500, if you want I'll put in a freight claim right now. They may want to keep the computer though. Let me know how you'd like to proceed.
I tell him that newspaper is useless packing and that the box should been packed tightly with bubblewrap or peanuts and that the second pic accurately shows how much packing was in the top of the box and he responds:
Had plenty on the top. UPS must have ripped it open and took it out. Newspaper works great I use it all the time. Also had lots of folded cardboard. I don t need to be lectured on shipping. Get mad at UPS it was fine before they threw it off the back of a truck. Do you want me to put the claim in or not?
I'm going to disassemble the keyboard this afternoon to see if it's damaged (stuck keys) and initiate a claim to recover what it will cost me to replace the broken parts.
Mike
Sorry it was damaged however you're incorrect in blaming me for it. The box isn't a storage box, it's a double walled cardboard box that's rated by the USPS for shipping. The contents were packed fairly tightly with newspaper and cardboard. There was no failing on my part when it came to packing of the contents. Just from looking at the box you can see it was kicked, dropped, and smashed dozens of times on it's way to you by UPS. Sure if I spent $300 and put it in a wooden crate with custom foam inserts and feathers it may have had a better outcome, but we have to be realistic here. I paid them $130 and more than clearly marked the contents as fragile. I expect better handling. Think about the amount of force you'd need to crack that casing. That could only happen if they dropped it off a truck or crushed it with another package.
Don't know why you're saying I'm lucky, the computer was poorly handled and damaged by people I trusted to do their job and get it to you in the condition I sent it.
It was insured for $500, if you want I'll put in a freight claim right now. They may want to keep the computer though. Let me know how you'd like to proceed.
I tell him that newspaper is useless packing and that the box should been packed tightly with bubblewrap or peanuts and that the second pic accurately shows how much packing was in the top of the box and he responds:
Had plenty on the top. UPS must have ripped it open and took it out. Newspaper works great I use it all the time. Also had lots of folded cardboard. I don t need to be lectured on shipping. Get mad at UPS it was fine before they threw it off the back of a truck. Do you want me to put the claim in or not?
I'm going to disassemble the keyboard this afternoon to see if it's damaged (stuck keys) and initiate a claim to recover what it will cost me to replace the broken parts.
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
I'm struggling to get a hard drive working on the 16. The initial problem is software.
From the Model II Archive, HANS01.IMD when converted, gives ERROR 11H immediately after the time is entered (as it did for pski in 2015). HANS02.IMD when loaded into the HxC emulator for conversion gets a response of "Load error! Read file error!" Ld6-drivers.imd, downloaded from Hans' dropbox, when converted also gives ERROR 11H immediately after the time is entered.
trshd2/dct & trsform2/cmd in the archive's LSD620SS.IMD apparently don't work with a Hans20 & Lo-Tech adapter?
What am I missing/doing wrong?
Mike
From the Model II Archive, HANS01.IMD when converted, gives ERROR 11H immediately after the time is entered (as it did for pski in 2015). HANS02.IMD when loaded into the HxC emulator for conversion gets a response of "Load error! Read file error!" Ld6-drivers.imd, downloaded from Hans' dropbox, when converted also gives ERROR 11H immediately after the time is entered.
trshd2/dct & trsform2/cmd in the archive's LSD620SS.IMD apparently don't work with a Hans20 & Lo-Tech adapter?
What am I missing/doing wrong?
Mike
First of all, I'm sorry about the damage. 16As are my favorite. He should have double boxed the computer. That newspaper does nothing. And I'll bet the keyboard took a pounding next to those manuals.
That aside, I'm sure Hans will chime in, but are you using a DOM with the Lo-Tech and you modified the Lo-Tech accordingly for the Model II?
That aside, I'm sure Hans will chime in, but are you using a DOM with the Lo-Tech and you modified the Lo-Tech accordingly for the Model II?
NF6X
Veteran Member
It hurts so much to see that damage. The seller is an idiot, and I hope that you can recover something from the claim and still make a working (though ugly) computer out of that.
Hans01
Experienced Member
@MikeModified
Ping, here I am.
Sorry, there were some problems converting the disks to IMD files.
To use the software you need a hans-02 and a LoTech adapter with a 128 Mb PQI Dom
Or a hans-01 and a modified LoTech adapter with a 128 Mb PQI Dom
Or the new DOM adapter from Ian.
If you send me a PM I'll mail you some .hfe image files.
Ping, here I am.
Sorry, there were some problems converting the disks to IMD files.
To use the software you need a hans-02 and a LoTech adapter with a 128 Mb PQI Dom
Or a hans-01 and a modified LoTech adapter with a 128 Mb PQI Dom
Or the new DOM adapter from Ian.
If you send me a PM I'll mail you some .hfe image files.
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
Thanks, Hans.
Yes, I'm using a hans-02 and LoTech adapter with the 128 Mb PQI Dom.
Mike
Yes, I'm using a hans-02 and LoTech adapter with the 128 Mb PQI Dom.
Mike
Mike, I'm a buyer and seller on ebay, and I have had only a few situations where I bought something and it came like this and never saw this kind of response from the seller.
That seller is a complete jackleg and you can file a Significantly Not As Described case, request a return and he has to pay $130 to ship a broken computer back, which he will not do.
His responses are totally inappropriate and he would lose a case in a heart beat. UPS would deny his claim as well, they would take one look at the pictures and say incorrect box, incorrect corner reinforcements, incorrect space between contents and outside of box, and incorrect padding material. I bet that box isn't even rated for what they used, and USPS is not UPS. UPS is notorious for their trick guidelines. Pack it like they say, it will more than likely survive. Should have used a triple wall heavy duty box with expanding foam to ship that. Manuals should not have been in that box either.
You can still open a case and ebay will find in your favor based on his poor responses and the responsibility he has to get it to you right, not to the shipping company right.
Since the item is damaged, HE has to pay to ship it back, not you, and he isn't going to do that and risk losing the case. Its also in a compromised condition and contains implosion risk now, UPS will not ship it back either. Its important that you don't talk about taking it apart or wanting to keep it at this point. You'll end up keeping it and get your money back as you deserve. If you don't have the packing materials he cant get the claim from UPS, this is between HIM and the shipper not you.
Bottom line is, if I had done this to you, I would have issued a full refund, apologized and it would be booked as a loss, because I know its my fault, I don't want to pay that kind of money to get it back and then deal with it.
You also have charge back rights on your credit card. Many sellers gripe about the protections for buyers, this jerk is why they exist, and I support the rules here.
If any of you want help when you get screwed like this, PM me, 18 years of experience and never lost a case as a seller (2), and never lost a case as a buyer (3), because I know whats right and wrong and how the rules apply.
That seller is a complete jackleg and you can file a Significantly Not As Described case, request a return and he has to pay $130 to ship a broken computer back, which he will not do.
His responses are totally inappropriate and he would lose a case in a heart beat. UPS would deny his claim as well, they would take one look at the pictures and say incorrect box, incorrect corner reinforcements, incorrect space between contents and outside of box, and incorrect padding material. I bet that box isn't even rated for what they used, and USPS is not UPS. UPS is notorious for their trick guidelines. Pack it like they say, it will more than likely survive. Should have used a triple wall heavy duty box with expanding foam to ship that. Manuals should not have been in that box either.
You can still open a case and ebay will find in your favor based on his poor responses and the responsibility he has to get it to you right, not to the shipping company right.
Since the item is damaged, HE has to pay to ship it back, not you, and he isn't going to do that and risk losing the case. Its also in a compromised condition and contains implosion risk now, UPS will not ship it back either. Its important that you don't talk about taking it apart or wanting to keep it at this point. You'll end up keeping it and get your money back as you deserve. If you don't have the packing materials he cant get the claim from UPS, this is between HIM and the shipper not you.
Bottom line is, if I had done this to you, I would have issued a full refund, apologized and it would be booked as a loss, because I know its my fault, I don't want to pay that kind of money to get it back and then deal with it.
You also have charge back rights on your credit card. Many sellers gripe about the protections for buyers, this jerk is why they exist, and I support the rules here.
If any of you want help when you get screwed like this, PM me, 18 years of experience and never lost a case as a seller (2), and never lost a case as a buyer (3), because I know whats right and wrong and how the rules apply.
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MikeModifed
Veteran Member
Thanks, Tibs! :bow:
Mike
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
Thanks for the software Hans (at nearly midnight in Germany).
Well, I've got something wrong someplace. Any command/program that tries to access the DOM, including DOMFORM6/CMD, goes to never-never-land.
My parts (does the Hans-02 need jumpers?):
When the 16 is turned on: Fault light OFF, Power light ON, Act. light NOTHING ever.
Mike
Well, I've got something wrong someplace. Any command/program that tries to access the DOM, including DOMFORM6/CMD, goes to never-never-land.
My parts (does the Hans-02 need jumpers?):
When the 16 is turned on: Fault light OFF, Power light ON, Act. light NOTHING ever.
Mike
MikeModifed
Veteran Member
Meanwhile, what's the least cumbersome 
method of cleaning the heads of the TM-848s?
Mike
method of cleaning the heads of the TM-848s?Mike
Caleb Hansberry
Veteran Member
I shipped a Performa 200, I thought it was securely packed but it arrived broken. I was pretty sad about that but I just issued a refund and told the buyer I was sorry they had to deal with it.
Hans01
Experienced Member
@MikeModifed
Thanks for the good pictures, it helps solving the problem.
There is a problem with the jumpers.
On the hans-02 Insert J3 only and J1 and J2 need to be open.
On the Lo-Tech JP1 need to be open.
C3 on the hans-02 is to bring power to the Lo-Tech
On the hans-02 pin 1 of C2 is where the printing C2 is.
On the Lo_Tech pin 1 of HD1 is where the printing HD1 is
The problem is most likely the JP1 jumper on the Lo-Tech, it selects the wrong set of I/O port.
It think it will solve your problem.
BTW. Mike I live in the Netherlands
Thanks for the good pictures, it helps solving the problem.
There is a problem with the jumpers.
On the hans-02 Insert J3 only and J1 and J2 need to be open.
On the Lo-Tech JP1 need to be open.
C3 on the hans-02 is to bring power to the Lo-Tech
On the hans-02 pin 1 of C2 is where the printing C2 is.
On the Lo_Tech pin 1 of HD1 is where the printing HD1 is
The problem is most likely the JP1 jumper on the Lo-Tech, it selects the wrong set of I/O port.
It think it will solve your problem.
BTW. Mike I live in the Netherlands
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Meanwhile, what's the least cumbersome
Mike
A good 8” cleaning disk is best for the TM-848. The heads are too difficult to reach with a q tip.