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Forum Rules and Etiquette

Our mission ...

This forum is part of our mission to promote the preservation of vintage computers through education and outreach. (In real life we also run events and have a museum.) We encourage you to join us, participate, share your knowledge, and enjoy.

This forum has been around in this format for over 15 years. These rules and guidelines help us maintain a healthy and active community, and we moderate the forum to keep things on track. Please familiarize yourself with these rules and guidelines.


Rule 1: Remain civil and respectful

There are several hundred people who actively participate here. People come from all different backgrounds and will have different ways of seeing things. You will not agree with everything you read here. Back-and-forth discussions are fine but do not cross the line into rude or disrespectful behavior.

Conduct yourself as you would at any other place where people come together in person to discuss their hobby. If you wouldn't say something to somebody in person, then you probably should not be writing it here.

This should be obvious but, just in case: profanity, threats, slurs against any group (sexual, racial, gender, etc.) will not be tolerated.


Rule 2: Stay close to the original topic being discussed
  • If you are starting a new thread choose a reasonable sub-forum to start your thread. (If you choose incorrectly don't worry, we can fix that.)
  • If you are responding to a thread, stay on topic - the original poster was trying to achieve something. You can always start a new thread instead of potentially "hijacking" an existing thread.



Rule 3: Contribute something meaningful

To put things in engineering terms, we value a high signal to noise ratio. Coming here should not be a waste of time.
  • This is not a chat room. If you are taking less than 30 seconds to make a post then you are probably doing something wrong. A post should be on topic, clear, and contribute something meaningful to the discussion. If people read your posts and feel that their time as been wasted, they will stop reading your posts. Worse yet, they will stop visiting and we'll lose their experience and contributions.
  • Do not bump threads.
  • Do not "necro-post" unless you are following up to a specific person on a specific thread. And even then, that person may have moved on. Just start a new thread for your related topic.
  • Use the Private Message system for posts that are targeted at a specific person.


Rule 4: "PM Sent!" messages (or, how to use the Private Message system)

This forum has a private message feature that we want people to use for messages that are not of general interest to other members.

In short, if you are going to reply to a thread and that reply is targeted to a specific individual and not of interest to anybody else (either now or in the future) then send a private message instead.

Here are some obvious examples of when you should not reply to a thread and use the PM system instead:
  • "PM Sent!": Do not tell the rest of us that you sent a PM ... the forum software will tell the other person that they have a PM waiting.
  • "How much is shipping to ....": This is a very specific and directed question that is not of interest to anybody else.


Why do we have this policy? Sending a "PM Sent!" type message basically wastes everybody else's time by making them having to scroll past a post in a thread that looks to be updated, when the update is not meaningful. And the person you are sending the PM to will be notified by the forum software that they have a message waiting for them. Look up at the top near the right edge where it says 'Notifications' ... if you have a PM waiting, it will tell you there.

Rule 5: Copyright and other legal issues

We are here to discuss vintage computing, so discussing software, books, and other intellectual property that is on-topic is fine. We don't want people using these forums to discuss or enable copyright violations or other things that are against the law; whether you agree with the law or not is irrelevant. Do not use our resources for something that is legally or morally questionable.

Our discussions here generally fall under "fair use." Telling people how to pirate a software title is an example of something that is not allowable here.


Reporting problematic posts

If you see spam, a wildly off-topic post, or something abusive or illegal please report the thread by clicking on the "Report Post" icon. (It looks like an exclamation point in a triangle and it is available under every post.) This send a notification to all of the moderators, so somebody will see it and deal with it.

If you are unsure you may consider sending a private message to a moderator instead.


New user moderation

New users are directly moderated so that we can weed spammers out early. This means that for your first 10 posts you will have some delay before they are seen. We understand this can be disruptive to the flow of conversation and we try to keep up with our new user moderation duties to avoid undue inconvenience. Please do not make duplicate posts, extra posts to bump your post count, or ask the moderators to expedite this process; 10 moderated posts will go by quickly.

New users also have a smaller personal message inbox limit and are rate limited when sending PMs to other users.


Other suggestions
  • Use Google, books, or other definitive sources. There is a lot of information out there.
  • Don't make people guess at what you are trying to say; we are not mind readers. Be clear and concise.
  • Spelling and grammar are not rated, but they do make a post easier to read.
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Some Craigslist listings

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    Some Craigslist listings

    Wilmington, NC
    vintage kaypro computer - $5 (lionsgate)
    ------
    Reply to: sale-637754354@craigslist.org
    Date: 2008-04-10, 6:29PM EDT

    relic of yesteryear --- your chance to have a piece of computer history.
    great conversation item for computer geeks and historians.

    if you want it come and get it otherwise its the in the trash can before too long
    Location: lionsgate


    Buffalo, NY
    Vintage Kaypro - $75 (Lockport)
    ------
    Reply to: sale-621129200@craigslist.org
    Date: 2008-03-27, 7:59PM EDT


    Kaypro 2x CP/M machine with DOS coprocessor and ram disk.
    Have operating system and business software for it.
    rwcovell@juno.com

    Location: Lockport


    Osborne Executive Computer - $25 (Pittsfield, MA)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Reply to: sale-627853386@craigslist.org
    Date: 2008-04-02, 3:19PM EDT

    Osborne Executive portable computer with all original software (CP/M Plus, WordStar, SuperCalc, MBASIC/CBASIC, Personal Pearl, UCSD p-System) and original documentation. Package includes Turbo Pascal, Turbo Toolbox and Turbo Tutor with documentation; Modem7, Infidel, Zork I, and assorted games in MBASIC and Machine Language. Also includes books: MS BASIC (Knecht), Osborne CP/M User Guide (Hogan), Programming in Pascal (Grogan), Software Tools in Pascal (Kernigan and Plauger). And the Warranty and a copy of the June 1983 issue of The Portable Companion magazine. It does work...

    Location: Pittsfield, MA

    #2
    Sure is a shame that Wilmington is clear on the other side of the state. I couldn't afford the gas it would eat up there and back. Especially at $3.45 a gallon. Which is an outrage of which there is NO excuse for. I'll stop there. I could go on quite a rant.
    That will be a sweet deal for someone out there on the coast.
    The world has moved on and left me behind. Therefore I choose to retreat into the past.

    Comment


      #3
      $3.45? Dang - and you're complaining?
      We've got areas down here in Miami that are $4.09 for 87 octane already!


      T

      Comment


        #4
        Guys,

        I don't think the cost of gas is relevant here. Also, if you are not going to pick up the item for personal reasons (like the cost of gas), then we probably don't need to read about it here. To me that equates to just another post that people have to sift through, thus decreasing our signal to noise ratio.

        Comment


          #5
          Kaypro 10 in Fort Mill, NC

          Kaypro 10 in Fort Mill,NC for $75. Has phone # to call, and pic in the listing.
          Here's the link:
          http://charlotte.craigslist.org/sys/649339330.html

          T

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Sharkonwheels View Post
            Kaypro 10 in Fort Mill,NC for $75. Has phone # to call, and pic in the listing.
            Here's the link:
            http://charlotte.craigslist.org/sys/649339330.html

            T

            Thanks for the info. That is a lot closer by far.
            The world has moved on and left me behind. Therefore I choose to retreat into the past.

            Comment


              #7
              If'n ya get THAT one, I can help ya get it up and running...
              That is assuming it actually needs anything!

              I'm "kinda' good with Kaypros"


              T

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Sharkonwheels View Post
                Wilmington, NC
                Osborne Executive Computer - $25 (Pittsfield, MA)
                --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                Reply to: sale-627853386@craigslist.org
                Date: 2008-04-02, 3:19PM EDT

                Osborne Executive portable computer with all original software (CP/M Plus, WordStar, SuperCalc, MBASIC/CBASIC, Personal Pearl, UCSD p-System) and original documentation. Package includes Turbo Pascal, Turbo Toolbox and Turbo Tutor with documentation; Modem7, Infidel, Zork I, and assorted games in MBASIC and Machine Language. Also includes books: MS BASIC (Knecht), Osborne CP/M User Guide (Hogan), Programming in Pascal (Grogan), Software Tools in Pascal (Kernigan and Plauger). And the Warranty and a copy of the June 1983 issue of The Portable Companion magazine. It does work...

                Location: Pittsfield, MA
                Ooo. I have family in that area that can pick this up. I've never had a CP/M computer before.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Ok Guys,

                  I feel my envy levels rising after reading all these posts about cheap/giveaway Osbornes, Kaypros and other CM/P goodies being available for just a drive away.

                  I'm turning green here (and no, it's not the homebrew!).

                  Tez
                  ------------------------------------------------
                  My vintage collection: https://classic-computers.org.nz/collection/
                  My vintage activities blog: https://www.classic-computers.org.nz/blog/
                  Twitter: @classiccomputNZ ; YouTube Videos: (click here)

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Kypro 4/84 $25 in Tacoma,WA

                    Tacoma, WA
                    Kaypro 4 84 Personal Computer ** - $25 (Tacoma)
                    --------------------------------------------------------------------------Reply to: sale-655497902@craigslist.org
                    Date: 2008-04-24, 11:54PM PDT

                    Kaypro 4 84
                    Classic PC!
                    25 OBO
                    Pick-up.

                    Has pic in listing...
                    http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/sys/655497902.html
                    Nice machine to have, as that has the '84 board, with the hard disk connector, probably hardware clock+modem, HH DS/DD drives. KayPLUS and TurboROM compatible...


                    Mesa, AZ
                    Kaypro 4 (EDIT: looks like an 83 model, FH drives)
                    Reply to: sale-651913064@craigslist.org
                    Date: 2008-04-22, 9:48AM MST

                    From what I researched this computer a KAYPRO 4 was made in about 1983 or so. The monitor boots up nicely.. It appears fully functional. I don't know much more about it sorry. I think it takes some kind of floppy operating system.
                    I only have a Lotus 123 FLOPPY.
                    Link has email, and phone num
                    http://phoenix.craigslist.org/sys/651913064.html



                    T

                    Comment


                      #11
                      3 Kaypros, 1 Osborne

                      'other one - freebies in Milwaukee, WI:

                      Real legacy computers-AKA CPM OS
                      --------------------------------------------------------------------------
                      Reply to: see below
                      Date: 2008-06-04, 11:15AM CDT

                      I've got 3 Kaypro's and 1 Osborne LUGGABLE computers w/software. Posted on Freecycle and had lots of replies and lots of no shows. So these have to go this week or to the dump they go. I'm in the Lilly and Lisbon Road area. Best time for P.U. will be between 10AM and 2PM unless we can make other arrangements.


                      Linkage


                      T

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Not sure why you're posting all these wonderful offerings, other than suggesting the bottom has fallen out of the value of vintage computers and that some of us could be overpricing our vintage computers. That has been the case seasonally as well as yearly for some time. Of course the state of the economy also plays a role. Someone who's worried about losing their job and income, not to mention their house, is unlikely to be ready to spend money on a frivolous hobby. I do believe that whatever the disimultudes of the current economy the market for vintage computers will eventually recover just as any rare item accrues value over time and people have the means to buy them. At those times of course trendiness and bragging rights also plays a role. How else can you explain the higher prices for an Osborne, clearly an inferior machine than a Kaypro but which are equally available.

                        Lawrence
                        Economics isn't a real science. It's an evil art designed for the rich.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Micom 2000 View Post
                          Not sure why you're posting all these wonderful offerings, other than suggesting the bottom has fallen out of the value of vintage computers and that some of us could be overpricing our vintage computers.
                          Or perhaps it was so that people that may be nearby can get a good deal on a vintage computer?

                          I don't think the "bottom has fallen out of the value of vintage computers" at all. Instead, the entire market is crashing. Awhile back, in happier, wealthier, times, I was looking into buying a new computer. Well I wanted one of those fancy IBMs with the XEON processor at 3GHz or whatever, but it would cost me $400 or so. Now that the market is down, I get get one on eBay for $125. Real prices. Everything in markets is getting way cheap; it is a great time for buyers with money, but sellers are hurting. But hey, gotta make money, so they sell anyway, and are thusly without realizing it fueling this crisis.

                          Save your money and take advantage of this market crisis! Hell of alot of really good deals to be found. I'd be spending if I didn't have to foward my mother money to pay for my move. And when I get it back? Well gas is predicted to be $7 to the gallon by September, so I wont be having much fun getting some spoils.

                          --Ryan
                          Sorry for the off-topic-rant of a post...Nice listings, though
                          Come to the dark side...we have cookies.
                          Wanted: Somebody to buy alot of my stuff
                          AT&T PC 6300 site

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I'm just posting the good ones, so people on here can snag them if they are nearby.

                            Lawrence, I have both Kaypros and Osbornes, and I like them both, but NEVER in MY eyes, will an Osborne be equivalent to the Kaypros. They are like comparing a Yugo to a Toyota!


                            T

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Heh, heh, heh. Yeah the YUGOs were disasterously BAD. I have a friend who made a wrong decision and bought one. Poor guy.

                              L
                              Economics isn't a real science. It's an evil art designed for the rich.

                              Comment

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