Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules and Etiquette

Our mission ...

This forum is part of our mission to promote the preservation of vintage computers through education and outreach. (In real life we also run events and have a museum.) We encourage you to join us, participate, share your knowledge, and enjoy.

This forum has been around in this format for over 15 years. These rules and guidelines help us maintain a healthy and active community, and we moderate the forum to keep things on track. Please familiarize yourself with these rules and guidelines.


Rule 1: Remain civil and respectful

There are several hundred people who actively participate here. People come from all different backgrounds and will have different ways of seeing things. You will not agree with everything you read here. Back-and-forth discussions are fine but do not cross the line into rude or disrespectful behavior.

Conduct yourself as you would at any other place where people come together in person to discuss their hobby. If you wouldn't say something to somebody in person, then you probably should not be writing it here.

This should be obvious but, just in case: profanity, threats, slurs against any group (sexual, racial, gender, etc.) will not be tolerated.


Rule 2: Stay close to the original topic being discussed
  • If you are starting a new thread choose a reasonable sub-forum to start your thread. (If you choose incorrectly don't worry, we can fix that.)
  • If you are responding to a thread, stay on topic - the original poster was trying to achieve something. You can always start a new thread instead of potentially "hijacking" an existing thread.



Rule 3: Contribute something meaningful

To put things in engineering terms, we value a high signal to noise ratio. Coming here should not be a waste of time.
  • This is not a chat room. If you are taking less than 30 seconds to make a post then you are probably doing something wrong. A post should be on topic, clear, and contribute something meaningful to the discussion. If people read your posts and feel that their time as been wasted, they will stop reading your posts. Worse yet, they will stop visiting and we'll lose their experience and contributions.
  • Do not bump threads.
  • Do not "necro-post" unless you are following up to a specific person on a specific thread. And even then, that person may have moved on. Just start a new thread for your related topic.
  • Use the Private Message system for posts that are targeted at a specific person.


Rule 4: "PM Sent!" messages (or, how to use the Private Message system)

This forum has a private message feature that we want people to use for messages that are not of general interest to other members.

In short, if you are going to reply to a thread and that reply is targeted to a specific individual and not of interest to anybody else (either now or in the future) then send a private message instead.

Here are some obvious examples of when you should not reply to a thread and use the PM system instead:
  • "PM Sent!": Do not tell the rest of us that you sent a PM ... the forum software will tell the other person that they have a PM waiting.
  • "How much is shipping to ....": This is a very specific and directed question that is not of interest to anybody else.


Why do we have this policy? Sending a "PM Sent!" type message basically wastes everybody else's time by making them having to scroll past a post in a thread that looks to be updated, when the update is not meaningful. And the person you are sending the PM to will be notified by the forum software that they have a message waiting for them. Look up at the top near the right edge where it says 'Notifications' ... if you have a PM waiting, it will tell you there.

Rule 5: Copyright and other legal issues

We are here to discuss vintage computing, so discussing software, books, and other intellectual property that is on-topic is fine. We don't want people using these forums to discuss or enable copyright violations or other things that are against the law; whether you agree with the law or not is irrelevant. Do not use our resources for something that is legally or morally questionable.

Our discussions here generally fall under "fair use." Telling people how to pirate a software title is an example of something that is not allowable here.


Reporting problematic posts

If you see spam, a wildly off-topic post, or something abusive or illegal please report the thread by clicking on the "Report Post" icon. (It looks like an exclamation point in a triangle and it is available under every post.) This send a notification to all of the moderators, so somebody will see it and deal with it.

If you are unsure you may consider sending a private message to a moderator instead.


New user moderation

New users are directly moderated so that we can weed spammers out early. This means that for your first 10 posts you will have some delay before they are seen. We understand this can be disruptive to the flow of conversation and we try to keep up with our new user moderation duties to avoid undue inconvenience. Please do not make duplicate posts, extra posts to bump your post count, or ask the moderators to expedite this process; 10 moderated posts will go by quickly.

New users also have a smaller personal message inbox limit and are rate limited when sending PMs to other users.


Other suggestions
  • Use Google, books, or other definitive sources. There is a lot of information out there.
  • Don't make people guess at what you are trying to say; we are not mind readers. Be clear and concise.
  • Spelling and grammar are not rated, but they do make a post easier to read.
See more
See less

XTIDE Universal BIOS v2.0.0 beta testing thread

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • dJOS
    replied
    Originally posted by irix View Post
    I don't like Compact Flash in a pc. I tried it running Windows 95, but it stalls every now and then for 10-20 seconds, really annoying. Now I only work with small (8gb) ssd drives and they work very well.
    Not only on really old pcs like 486, but also on p3 type pcs and even Amigas like them.
    I only used it temporarily to setup some c.f. Cards while I was waiting for my Tandy 1000ex computer to arrive.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Originally posted by dJOS View Post
    I've even got a Lo-tech Compact flash controller working in a K6-III+ 500 with ISA, PCI & AGP! It's seriously flexible!
    I don't like Compact Flash in a pc. I tried it running Windows 95, but it stalls every now and then for 10-20 seconds, really annoying. Now I only work with small (8gb) ssd drives and they work very well.
    Not only on really old pcs like 486, but also on p3 type pcs and even Amigas like them.

    Leave a comment:


  • dJOS
    replied
    Originally posted by irix View Post
    I've had success with XTIDE on 2 different VLB machines with VLB controllers,
    I've even got a Lo-tech Compact flash controller working in a K6-III+ 500 with ISA, PCI & AGP! It's seriously flexible!

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    I've had success with XTIDE on 2 different VLB machines with VLB controllers, both 486 (SX33 and DX2/66), as long as I configure the ISA network card (A UMC one) correctly, that's away from other addresses (like sound cards, SCSI cards and so on) and as long as the start address is set to d000h it works fine every time. So the problem was in the Google download after all. I did run the config tool on the target machines, but autoconfig does not work for me, but I just set it by hand and it's ok every time now.
    Now sorting out memory problems on the DX2 mainboard, but that's not related to XTIDE as memtest also fails without the NIC.

    Leave a comment:


  • Krille
    replied
    Originally posted by irix View Post
    I've used the 12Kb ATL-version that is on google code.
    Yes, that's the old version I was referring to.

    I was afraid to use the one you're linking to as it was a 'strange' 8.9Kb in size. But then again, I've burned it onto a 16K chip, leaving the rest blank, so it should not matter really.
    Yeah, as Malc said, you need to load it with XTIDECFG and let it do its magic (it pads the BIOS size to the size defined in the ROM block count at offset 2 and adds a checksum to the end).

    Sometimes it bypasses everything and then tells me there is no basic rom installed (while this motherboard doesn't have a socket for a basic rom).
    I'll try the 8.9K version you linked to, see what it does. I've had the problems on 2 machines now and all sorts of other strange things. Tried swapping out everything else from psu to memory but everything seems to be fine (except probably the XTIDE Universal BIOS I tried).
    When the BIOS can't find anything to boot from it will invoke interrupt 18h which runs ROM BASIC on old IBM machines. On clone machines, particularly in the 486 era, the system BIOS will just print "NO ROM BASIC" or something to that effect.

    So this message basically tells us that the harddrive controller can't be found.

    Originally posted by irix View Post
    I'm probably doing something wrong here.
    I've downloaded the 8.9K rom image, burned it onto a 16K rom (27c128 ) just at the start and left the rest empty.
    For the 12K Google Code version this worked, but the 8.9K doesn't even seem to run.
    I didn't run xtidecfg.exe as this wasn't needed on my previous rom, maybe that's wrong?
    Yes, that's wrong. The AT-builds of XUB can technically be installed as-is and it will usually work (so long as the size and checksum is correct as I said above) because AT-machines are standardized and similar in configuration. However, it is still recommended to reconfigure the BIOS with XTIDECFG as there are a number of options that you'll likely want to change. For example, you might want to minimize boot times by reducing the IDE controller count to 1 if that's all you've got - there's no point in trying to detect drives on a secondary IDE interface if there's no such thing.

    On XT-builds of XUB you're required to reconfigure the XUB as there's no standard and if it works without reconfiguration it will be by sheer luck. All builds are made with the most common options pre-set but that only goes so far.

    Originally posted by irix View Post
    Ok so I ran it again on the target pc, Auto Configure hust stalls/crashes the pc.
    But I can find my way in manual config, just 1 question: it says control block at 3F0, but on my IDE controller (VLB Winbond W83759AA) I see my floppy controller is at 3F0 (setting this to 370 with a jumper results in a "floppy controller failure" in my regular bios).
    Can I let this control block at 3F0 or do I need to change that to something else? Not sure what this does, I think the rest is quite understandable.
    Ah, so this is a VLB controller. I have no personal experience with those (I've neved had a VLB machine or even seen one in person) but I've read that they can be quite finicky. Make sure its configured correctly regarding bus speed and that the slot and the edge connectors are clean and making proper contact. Also, try reducing the bus speed if possible to see if the problem persists.

    As I understand it, port 3F0h is shared between the IDE and floppy controller so that should not be the problem. Besides, XUB only accesses port 3F6h anyway.

    Originally posted by Malc View Post
    IIRC the XUB has limited support for VLB cards, I remember Some support was added but i can't remember what VLB cards it was for, It might be why autoconfigure is not working on your machine, Have you got an IDE/Floppy controller you can use.
    With no native support in XUB the VLB controller should work just like a regular ISA controller. The VLB controllers with native support in XUB are QDI Vision QD6500 and QD6580. There is also code to support the Promise PDC 20230 and PDC 20630 controllers but it has not been tested yet as far as I know.
    Last edited by Krille; October 21, 2017, 08:13 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Originally posted by Malc View Post
    See 'Menu items on "xxx IDE Controller" submenus' and 'IDE controllers on VLB and PCI bus' on the XUB website www.xtideuniversalbios.org, I'm not sure if changing settings for the VLB card will do any good, Hopefully Krill will be along to answer that.
    With the pre-compiled Google code version everything works fine, just not every single time, sometimes it just won't see anything at all, that's the only problem I've had with that version.
    So the only thing I'd like to know is what Control Block does and if it's a problem is it's on the same address as the fdc, or that this is just pointing to where the fdc actually is, then it needs to be at 3F0, because the fdc is.

    Edit: just tried it, for now it seems to run fine, but I have to continue testing before I can be sure. But at least the 1st boot was successful.
    Last edited by irix; October 19, 2017, 05:26 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Malc
    replied
    See 'Menu items on "xxx IDE Controller" submenus' and 'IDE controllers on VLB and PCI bus' on the XUB website www.xtideuniversalbios.org, I'm not sure if changing settings for the VLB card will do any good, Hopefully Krill will be along to answer that.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Originally posted by Malc View Post
    IIRC the XUB has limited support for VLB cards, I remember Some support was added but i can't remember what VLB cards it was for, It might be why autoconfigure is not working on your machine, Have you got an IDE/Floppy controller you can use.
    I have one, but that doesn't seem to match this pc at all, it doesn't want to start up past the VGA bios when that's inserted.
    When I know what "control block" at 3F0 means I can either leave it (same as floppy drive) or change this away from the floppy drive, to for example 370.

    Leave a comment:


  • Malc
    replied
    IIRC the XUB has limited support for VLB cards, I remember Some support was added but i can't remember what VLB cards it was for, It might be why autoconfigure is not working on your machine, Have you got an IDE/Floppy controller you can use.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Ok so I ran it again on the target pc, Auto Configure hust stalls/crashes the pc.
    But I can find my way in manual config, just 1 question: it says control block at 3F0, but on my IDE controller (VLB Winbond W83759AA) I see my floppy controller is at 3F0 (setting this to 370 with a jumper results in a "floppy controller failure" in my regular bios).
    Can I let this control block at 3F0 or do I need to change that to something else? Not sure what this does, I think the rest is quite understandable.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Originally posted by Malc View Post
    You must run XTIDECFG.COM and configure the bios for your machine, Use the autoconfigure option if you are booting the 486 via floppy, and save the changes back to file, XTIDECFG.COM will do it's magic and add the checksum byte. Also on your 486 go into the system bios and set hard drives to 'None', This will give control to the XUB.
    So the Google code ones are pre-configured I guess.
    I tried doing auto config on them, but then the whole pc stalled. I'll try these with this config.

    Leave a comment:


  • Malc
    replied
    You must run XTIDECFG.COM and configure the bios for your machine, Use the autoconfigure option if you are booting the 486 via floppy, and save the changes back to file, XTIDECFG.COM will do it's magic and add the checksum byte. Also on your 486 go into the system bios and set hard drives to 'None', This will give control to the XUB.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    I'm probably doing something wrong here.
    I've downloaded the 8.9K rom image, burned it onto a 16K rom (27c128 ) just at the start and left the rest empty.
    For the 12K Google Code version this worked, but the 8.9K doesn't even seem to run.
    I didn't run xtidecfg.exe as this wasn't needed on my previous rom, maybe that's wrong?

    Same kind of rom, same NIC, so it is configured to boot from the bootrom. I just swapped the rom out. Any ideas?
    Last edited by irix; October 19, 2017, 01:23 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • irix
    replied
    Originally posted by Krille View Post
    I'm inclined to say it's a hardware problem but I suppose it could be a timing problem of sorts. Hard to say really.

    It sounds like you're using the old and buggy beta 3 version? If so, try the latest version available from here. Not that I expect that to fix the problem but you never know. Also, you could try the SSD in another machine with a different BIOS - if it works there then it's probably not a hardware problem.
    I've used the 12Kb ATL-version that is on google code. I was afraid to use the one you're linking to as it was a 'strange' 8.9Kb in size. But then again, I've burned it onto a 16K chip, leaving the rest blank, so it should not matter really.
    Sometimes it bypasses everything and then tells me there is no basic rom installed (while this motherboard doesn't have a socket for a basic rom).
    I'll try the 8.9K version you linked to, see what it does. I've had the problems on 2 machines now and all sorts of other strange things. Tried swapping out everything else from psu to memory but everything seems to be fine (except probably the XTIDE Universal BIOS I tried).

    Leave a comment:


  • Krille
    replied
    I'm inclined to say it's a hardware problem but I suppose it could be a timing problem of sorts. Hard to say really.

    It sounds like you're using the old and buggy beta 3 version? If so, try the latest version available from here. Not that I expect that to fix the problem but you never know. Also, you could try the SSD in another machine with a different BIOS - if it works there then it's probably not a hardware problem.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X