Forum Rules and Etiquette

Our mission ...

This forum is part of our mission to promote the preservation of vintage computers through education and outreach. (In real life we also run events and have a museum.) We encourage you to join us, participate, share your knowledge, and enjoy.

This forum has been around in this format for over 15 years. These rules and guidelines help us maintain a healthy and active community, and we moderate the forum to keep things on track. Please familiarize yourself with these rules and guidelines.

Rule 1: Remain civil and respectful

There are several hundred people who actively participate here. People come from all different backgrounds and will have different ways of seeing things. You will not agree with everything you read here. Back-and-forth discussions are fine but do not cross the line into rude or disrespectful behavior.

Conduct yourself as you would at any other place where people come together in person to discuss their hobby. If you wouldn't say something to somebody in person, then you probably should not be writing it here.

This should be obvious but, just in case: profanity, threats, slurs against any group (sexual, racial, gender, etc.) will not be tolerated.

Rule 2: Stay close to the original topic being discussed
  • If you are starting a new thread choose a reasonable sub-forum to start your thread. (If you choose incorrectly don't worry, we can fix that.)
  • If you are responding to a thread, stay on topic - the original poster was trying to achieve something. You can always start a new thread instead of potentially "hijacking" an existing thread.

Rule 3: Contribute something meaningful

To put things in engineering terms, we value a high signal to noise ratio. Coming here should not be a waste of time.
  • This is not a chat room. If you are taking less than 30 seconds to make a post then you are probably doing something wrong. A post should be on topic, clear, and contribute something meaningful to the discussion. If people read your posts and feel that their time as been wasted, they will stop reading your posts. Worse yet, they will stop visiting and we'll lose their experience and contributions.
  • Do not bump threads.
  • Do not "necro-post" unless you are following up to a specific person on a specific thread. And even then, that person may have moved on. Just start a new thread for your related topic.
  • Use the Private Message system for posts that are targeted at a specific person.

Rule 4: "PM Sent!" messages (or, how to use the Private Message system)

This forum has a private message feature that we want people to use for messages that are not of general interest to other members.

In short, if you are going to reply to a thread and that reply is targeted to a specific individual and not of interest to anybody else (either now or in the future) then send a private message instead.

Here are some obvious examples of when you should not reply to a thread and use the PM system instead:
  • "PM Sent!": Do not tell the rest of us that you sent a PM ... the forum software will tell the other person that they have a PM waiting.
  • "How much is shipping to ....": This is a very specific and directed question that is not of interest to anybody else.

Why do we have this policy? Sending a "PM Sent!" type message basically wastes everybody else's time by making them having to scroll past a post in a thread that looks to be updated, when the update is not meaningful. And the person you are sending the PM to will be notified by the forum software that they have a message waiting for them. Look up at the top near the right edge where it says 'Notifications' ... if you have a PM waiting, it will tell you there.

Rule 5: Copyright and other legal issues

We are here to discuss vintage computing, so discussing software, books, and other intellectual property that is on-topic is fine. We don't want people using these forums to discuss or enable copyright violations or other things that are against the law; whether you agree with the law or not is irrelevant. Do not use our resources for something that is legally or morally questionable.

Our discussions here generally fall under "fair use." Telling people how to pirate a software title is an example of something that is not allowable here.

Reporting problematic posts

If you see spam, a wildly off-topic post, or something abusive or illegal please report the thread by clicking on the "Report Post" icon. (It looks like an exclamation point in a triangle and it is available under every post.) This send a notification to all of the moderators, so somebody will see it and deal with it.

If you are unsure you may consider sending a private message to a moderator instead.

New user moderation

New users are directly moderated so that we can weed spammers out early. This means that for your first 10 posts you will have some delay before they are seen. We understand this can be disruptive to the flow of conversation and we try to keep up with our new user moderation duties to avoid undue inconvenience. Please do not make duplicate posts, extra posts to bump your post count, or ask the moderators to expedite this process; 10 moderated posts will go by quickly.

New users also have a smaller personal message inbox limit and are rate limited when sending PMs to other users.

Other suggestions
  • Use Google, books, or other definitive sources. There is a lot of information out there.
  • Don't make people guess at what you are trying to say; we are not mind readers. Be clear and concise.
  • Spelling and grammar are not rated, but they do make a post easier to read.
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For the love of God... I want an IBM 5170 manual...

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    For the love of God... I want an IBM 5170 manual...

    They usually come in sets of three books in 3-ring binders that are quite thick and cover the PC AT from case to screw. If anyone has one/them, maybe they could scan them in?

    I've been trying to get the books themselves so I could scan them, but whomever I meet who has them asks rediculous (atleast to me) prices. I'll keep trying, though...

    What do you consider rediculous prices?

    I've seen complete AT manual sets, NIB, on eBay for under $60 which I think is fair (considering condition).

    Or are you talking about the Technical Reference manual? Those are a bit more costly. . .

    The Vintage Computer and Gaming Marketplace
    The Vintage Computer


      Well, because I'm an unemployed Canadian, anything over $20 US is stupendous, hehe!

      And I'm talking about the referance -and- technical documentation books for the AT, together. I've been told prices between $40 and $100 for the three books from different owers.

      Oh well, if I want them bad enough I'll save my money and pay. Which is quite difficult, seeing how I need a math coprocessor now, too.

      The trial and tribulations of vintage computer restorations...


        Slasher dude, sometimes you just have to bite the bullet.

        I bought a PS/2 BIOS reference. That led to buying a 3 volume set called "Technical Reference: Options and Adapters". The outlay was over $100 US, and I was happy to find it - they're rare.

        I have the AT Tech ref. Is there something in particular you need? There isn't enough time in my lifetime to scan it, so don't even think about it.

        While we're on the topic, I'd like to find a PC tech ref and an XT tech ref. I have a PCjr tech ref, and having the set would sure help me on my Jr problems ... (It's nice to see how the 'big' boys did things so that I can tell what's messed up about the Jr.)


          Re: For the love of God... I want an IBM 5170 manual...

          Originally posted by Super-Slasher
          They usually come in sets of three books in 3-ring binders that are quite thick and cover the PC AT from case to screw.
          Actually there are a lot of manuals. I used to have the PC/XT Hardware TRM, I do have (somewhere) an older DOS TRM which prolly covers up to about 3.00 or so.


            I have a working scanner now, so if I could only borrow the books I want.

            Maybe I'll try probing around in the city a bit deeper. The PC AT was a most popular system in the mid-to-late 80's, surely there must be a copy of atleast one of the books in my city of 40,000...


              I know it is a REALLY old thread, but are you still after a set of 5170 AT manuals? On eBay UK at the moment are two auctions, one for the Guide to Operations and Installation and setup books, the other for Hardware Maintenance and Service volumes 1 and 2: